“GOODLUCK SUBMARINE”….THE SHAPE OF THINGS TO COME??

The boss of CSOC presents a model of a submarine to Nigeria's First Lady, Dame Patience Jonathan

The boss of CSOC presents a model of a submarine to Nigeria’s First Lady, Dame Patience Jonathan

About beegeagle

BEEG EAGLE -perspectives of an opinionated Nigerian male with a keen interest in Geopolitics, Defence and Strategic Studies
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71 Responses to “GOODLUCK SUBMARINE”….THE SHAPE OF THINGS TO COME??

  1. wocon45 says:

    I was at a quite poetry night event when email of a new post hit my phone ……without see the picture i jumped from my seat and was shouting then I q
    saw the image….. can’t wait for tge remaining beans to be spilled.

  2. beegeagle says:

    I am willing to put my head on the block and say that Nigeria’s first submarine would be delivered within 24-36 months. The presentation of this model also tells me that it is going to be a Chinese-built submarine, possibly with ‘open architecture’ which allows for the incorporation of Chinese and Western commercial technologies and it shall be built by CSOC.

    YES, the acquisition of littoral incterceptors, light frigates, OPVs, submarines, helicopters and LPDs is articulated in the NN’s 10 Year Strategic Acquisition Plan

    BACKGROUNDERS

    http://www.beegeagle.wordpress.com/2011/10/28/the-nigerian-navys-ten-year-expansion-plan-revisited/

    A few years ago, BEEGEAGLE alluded to the possibility that our sub-surface fleet shall almost certainly kick off with Chinese-built submarine (the whisper-quiet Song class, he imagined)

    https://beegeagle.wordpress.com/2012/02/16/recap-nigerian-navy-personnel-in-pakistan-for-submarine-training/

    • jimmy says:

      I do not want to be the first to state that i told you so because I am not the first. No nation has achieved greatness without securing her marine as well as land borders. Nigeria has a TWO FOLD WHAMMY it is trusted with not only her marine coastal areas which are full of some it’s most sensitive, strategic oil reserves and off shore Multi Billion dollar off shore rigs and platforms.
      Nigeria is also trusted now for all intents and purposes with securing the continental shelf of the gulf of Guinea. Let me relay two incidents for two different countries that happened involving our RUSKIE friends. In Senegal a Russian Trawler was caught RED HANDED fishing illegally off the coast of Senegal. The crew were arrested and probably for good measured roughed up a little bit in a dank SENEGALESE jail. There was no trial but the ship was confiscated and the company was made to pay a fine of $1m dollars after which the captain stupidly complained about being roughed up.The same type of situation occured in Nigeria. The trial lasted over two years, Yes the crew spent time in a god forsaken jail and were made to pay heavy bail amounts of $500k but eventually in the interests of military sales were released , on the other hand THe F.G SHOULD OF FINED EACH PERSON A MILLION DOLLARS.What is the connection ? a submarine could easily of dispatched this ship without any warning no trace, this will then become the fear of wisdom for those who are willing to trespass illegally at some point Nigeria as a fellow blogger said has to get serious about its own SECURITY if it is China that will build three Subs so be it they really need to get the subs , they can afford AND IT IS TO PROTECT YOUR MOST SENSITIVE ASSETS NAMELY OIL NATURAL GAS AND YOUR FISHING WHAT ELSE SHOULD Nigeria be using her money to protect?

    • CHYDE says:

      Oga Beegs, is there something you aren’t telling us, you seem so confident as regards delivery time, is ‘there something else’ we should know? Lol

  3. beegeagle says:

    Do not forget also that when a Chinese oceanographic survey vessel came around these parts in August 2012 and charted the entire length of our coastline and with NN personnel participating, BEEGEAGLE also suggested that it was possibly done with future submarine operations in mind.

    H-Hour beckons…the giant is awakening.

    NUGGET

    “Do not be surprised if they are already
    charting the ocean floor preparatory to
    the delivery of Chinese submarines in the not-too-distant future. A 9-day survey shall surely encompass the entire
    coastline – including potential ‘deep harbours’ such as Ikot Abasi and Escravos. We know our people too well. Remember that in 2008, Nigerian Navy officers were training in submarine warfare in Pakistan?”

    END

    https://beegeagle.wordpress.com/2012/08/22/chinese-oceanographic-ship-startes-joint-mission-in-nigerian-waters-6-nigerian-navy-personnel-on-board/

    BEEGEAGLE’S BLOG..we say what we mean, mean what we say

  4. Henry says:

    Hopefully we get to see concrete agreements signed in a few months time. At-least 3 subs for our navy.

  5. Are James says:

    Submarine operations can be dangerous and the game changes when we acquire one. Hope the NN leadership and purse strings controllers realize this and change their MO

    • Are James says:

      There could be no better way for the Chinese to guarantee that this new order is made than what we are seeing in the picture. Present MP the model of the sub, watch and wait for the boss of the boss to do her thing… pronto.

  6. beegeagle says:

    And the brasshat who you see in the photo, for emphasis, is Rear Admiral Emmanuel Ogbor..Chief of Policy and PLANS of the NN. Watch this space then.

    Good morning, gentlemen.

  7. beegeagle says:

    REWIND to this period last year

    Model of a warship in view

    Vice Admiral Dele Ezeoba, Chief of the Naval Staff (left) and a high official of the China Shipbuilding and Offshore International Limited conclude ‘strategic plans’ to move the Nigerian Navy forward

    Photo Credit: NIGERIAN NAVY

    It is looking increasingly likely that with the NN clocking 60 come 2016, CSOC shall almost certainly deliver some ‘sneak acquisitions’ – Type 056 light frigates, a LPD and submarines.

    Interesting times lie ahead for friends and personnel of the Nigerian Navy.

  8. beegeagle says:

    The NAF shall be marking their 50th anniversary in April 2014.

    From a SIPRI report last year, we heard that the NAF are expecting the delivery of

    * 3 Mi-35P attack helics
    * 6 Mi-171Sh Terminator assault helics

    From a Russian report posted last month by Oga Are James on these pages, we learnt that the NAF are also expecting the delivery of

    * 4 Mi-17 transport helicopters

    From a Budget Office of the Federation statement posted online in 2014, we understand that the NAF are expecting the delivery of

    * 6 Mi-35M attack helicopters

    So the ‘under representing’ NAF are getting a major new lease of life with a total of 19 helicopters (15 attack+assault and 4 transport helics).

    What we do not yet know for certain is whether or not the NAF shall take delivery of any attack jets with which they have been linked by persistent defence media reports, namely the JF-17 Thunder and the L15 Falcon.

    Air Expo 2015 should answer some of these questions, HOPEFULLY.

  9. Oje says:

    Nice. Good to see the Navy getting things right, I wonder why the Nigerian airforce have preference for Heligunships instead over attack jets.

  10. triggah says:

    It will certainly be a welcome developement.

  11. Tope says:

    Submarine it is barring any unforseen circumstance, you don’t send people since 2008 to go and train on Pakistani subs which are quite similar in design to chinese architecture that’s by 2014 count dats 6yrs……dis hands need not be idle, secondly u don’t chart ur waters if u don’t plan to have submarines sailing ur water abi na fish dem wan catch? This are Concrete prepartory plans to buying the Submarine, for me I think the deal has been signed off, the boss showed them the model it will be and all we would see is the Sub sailing home, since Sub Operation is always shrouded in Secrecy from Construction to deployment we can expect it will sail into our waters without anyone’s knowledge personally I like that idea, a Silent ship that just appears off the water and bam! Nabs Pirates……well Onward Together Is our Motto I speak cos I went through the Navy small……The sea is urs for the taking…..Sail Well NN.

  12. beegeagle says:

    Yes o, Triggah.

    Time was in 1986 when the FMG were in the hunt for two Foxtrot submarines and five Chinook helics. We have left it for too long and really should take things to the next level. I mean, our naval aviation branch lifted off in 1984, so what have we been waiting for before starting off a sub-surface arm?

    If it is indeed the case that the P18N OPV/Type 056 light frigate deal has an option for a total of ten ships and that the NN stand to gain LPDs and submarines from the Chinese transaction, I suggest that we negotiate into any such deal, two used, free Type 053H2 frigates as sweetener. That is precisely what the Bangladeshis have done for a pittance on a deal for two Type 056 light frigates, two 64 metre missile craft built and two Harbin Z-9C naval helicopters.

    Personally, I do not think we are optimally leveraging on our ties with the Chinese. As of July 2013, we had a US$36.4 bn Chinese footprint in Nigeria on construction projects and trade deals alone. China are decommissioning a lot of her combined fleet of fifty three Type 053 frigates ; Type 053H1 variant of 1980s vintage – such as are in service with Egypt, Bangladesh, Pakistan and the Type 053H2 variant of 1990s vintage.Smart naval planners are cashing in on the boon as we speak.

    We can get those from China who are reportedly deleting missiles and installing lighter guns on some of these ships intended for law enforcement duties and they are transferring many of them to the China Marine Surveillance for service as OPVs.

    China have offered a carte blanche since 2012 and pointedly stated that they can help to modernise our navy. I am sure we have not even asked as a follow up to that even as countries such as Burma have received a pair of used Type 053 frigates for free.

    My belief is that given the quality of military shipbuilding coming out at this time in the form of Type 056 corvettes/OPVs, Type 054 area defence frigates and Type 052 destroyers, we stand to gain a lot…and baggage-free to boot, from China. So have Pakistan, Bangladesh, Egypt. Not to mention Algeria who have lately placed an order for three F22A frigates.

  13. rka says:

    It is indeed a good development, although I will blow a wind of caution to the Nigerian Navy hierarchy by advising if they have or plan to go down the route of submarine operations, you cannot cut corners in regard to training and maintenance as there is no way back if things go wrong underwater.

    You have to be fully committed as submarine operations are very expensive indeed, otherwise, we will end up with white elephants.

    • Are James says:

      Defence expenditure is now first line charge budget item also our military leadership are getting more confident articulating their needs to the two tiers of government.

      The Russians lost 116 men at 350 feet below the high seas (you almost want to close your eyes in horror thinking about it) because of carelessness and maybe scrimping on operational integrity checks.
      Nigeria has to grow up, its upon us now, no running away. The same principles are what you bring to flying an aircraft or operating a power station without disaster. Our political appointees have to be educated on the fiscal imperatives of being the richest and most populous black nation on earth and fund the armed forces adequately so that for the Navy in this instance all they need for maintenance and operational integrity is provided otherwise you have to answer to about 116 families as we saw with the Russians.

  14. Oje says:

    There is no white elephant when it comes to the military, that said i am of the opinion that our so our Defense chiefs know nothing on advanced weapons systems or strategy, if they did we will not be wasting precious manpower and logistics in taking out terror camps when a single cruise missile can do the job often with minimal response time for the terrorists. Boko Haram Camps are hardly obscure. If we integrate the 5 Nigerian satellites in Space to our network of Drones (3 currently operational) all we need are cruise missiles, not necessary the Tomahawk cruise missile employed by the U.S. but something similar, energy hungry China will be more than willing to sell us a couple.

    • Are James says:

      To backup your point, the Nigerian Army artillery corps is one of the most skilled. The stories out of Liberia and Sierra Leone have been most revealing. Now think of the capabilities with UAVs in the artillery target integration role which is becoming standard operating procedure the world over. You almost don’t even need cruise missiles just real time tx of coordinates to a crew manning the latest Bofors guns in the NA inventory and its death and destruction at night to the militants.

  15. Solorex says:

    Sirs, Lunching Satellite and buying cruise missiles for Boko haram is like hunting roaches with a dane gun; it is a mismatch. Compare cost to results and it’s clear we will achieve better result with a bit more prudent spending. Boko haram are not hi-tech guys and targeted killing of big birds will most likely not wane them down like al-Qaida- these guys are regularly manufactured in local factories at rates of hundreds per week- courtesy of the fact that force has not been commensurate with PR, civil re-orientation program and good policing cum intelligence gathering/ management. I wish we would carefully study what the Russians did to contain mass (well-armed and hi-tech) insurgency in three separate regions (each bigger than Northern Nigeria) within ten years with great results.

    Our military needs are just basic (we already have the human resources and the basic know how-a deep understanding of our foes and their routes); more air patrols, Standoff range artillery, more coin aircraft (helix, drones, Tucanos…..), more APCs – a workable political-military-religious multi-pronged approach. We are already winning (albeit in a slow and annoying manner)
    I do not believe in a GoodLuck Submarine; Submarines are for navies entrenched blue intentions; Never seen a Navy with subs without well-armed frigates and LSDs in this modern era. The basic are important – the frigates, LSTs & LSDs, decently armed modern corvettes and more air patrol assets. Subs are very costly to acquire, more costly to maintain – they are also easily degradable and cannot be managed to sail like regular vessels. They also require specialized dry docking facility and training- you must have a sub training school also. They must be constantly upgraded to make them relevant in the age of modern torps. I have not seen enough in NN budgets, (over the past five years) and infrastructural development and training pattern that suggest any sub is nearby. They will need more than good luck to acquire this.

  16. startrek says:

    frankly I believe Nigeria should start buy in anything buyable military/intelligence wise right now. BH or not Nigeria has got a big one coming and its externally induced and….

  17. Oje says:

    Oga Solorex, I fail to agree with you on that one. We all complain when the government fail to invest heavily on the military and still complain when they start spenind big on military hardware, calling it a waste. Let’s deviate from being opposed to anything the govt does by default. How long should the richest black nation on earth continue running a Navy made up of Speedboats? Plus the submarine being purchased are Deisel subs not multi billion dollar SSBN or Los Angeles class Boomers. The Aradu, Thunder, Stealth OPV etc can be deployed far from our coastal shores with a submarine riding shotgun.

  18. Manny Aydel says:

    I agree with Oje as I think your drift makes sense. However, Solorex has a salient point regarding our navy being mentally and ‘infrastructurally’ able to support sub ops. I hope we have come a long way after the fate that befell Dorina and Otobo (extremely basic platforms when compared to subs). The seamanship skills and maintenance ability of the NN has to be seriously stepped up. Onward together!

  19. Obix says:

    @Ogas Oje and Manny, we all know that the ill fate that befell those ships was as a result of the sanctions that were in place till 1999. By 1999 most of them were already in terrible shapes though naval dock did tried to put some of them back in the waters. Pay attention to this chart and you’ll see that most of the mentioned ships were not sea worthy as at 1999 http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/nigeria/navy-equipment-2009.htm . If the Nigerian Navy plans to acquire submarines, with the transformation going on we should not doubt the fact that the manpower and know how will be in place at the right time. We can be proud that for decades our armed forces have been led by real professionals, if not, the sanctions would have decayed the armed forces terribly like it did in some other countries.

    • igbi says:

      I often get the impression some people commenting on this blog are antagonizing Nigeria’s ambitions to become stronger. I think our Cameroonian friends on this blog will reveal themselves by their “body character”. Let’s face it, the guys calling for the Nigerian armed forces to not upgrade are probably not Nigerians, they actually see Nigeria as a threat to their own country.

    • igbi says:

      I don’t think your timing is correct. I do think on the other hand that procurement was hampered by Engozi and it is time to catch up with our time. The most important thing is that we learn the technology, but we can’t keep saying later, things need to happen now.

  20. Are James says:

    This guy is holding too many impromptu meetings. Send Okonjo on vacation for two weeks and release money for the boys to buy their kit, especially the airforce.
    Too much talking subtracts from effective action:
    http://thenationonlineng.net/new/jonathan-service-chiefs-meet-over-insecurity-2/

  21. Max Montero says:

    Scale models presented to someone on top of the government (in this case the first lady herself) says a lot of things that words sometimes can’t say. Good luck to Nigeria!

    Max (maxdefense.blogspot.com)

    • giles says:

      y should he,wen others made der own comment did any body arrest dem?pls let’s leave dis politics out of dis.

      • igbi says:

        the guy is threatening to distroy Nigeria, yet you are coming here trying to defend him.
        I am sorry Oga giles, but politics stop when you threaten Nigeria. Once you have done that you are an enemy of the state. So please don’t call this politics, I urge every well meaning Nigerian to sue Dokubo for the comments he keeps making in the media and get back that money which he doesn’t deserve.

    • tim says:

      Oga igbi, thanks a lot, I thought common sense,would speak to giles……..I wonder why sss, has not picked him up, and went after el-rufai.

      • giles says:

        common sense? If d militant should speaks onli but a few would repond.but wen a public figure alter as el-rufia should speak u kwn wot would happen.and der is a clear diff btw an ex-militant and ex-minister

      • igbi says:

        Look, we are not playing the comparison game here, what matters is Nigeria and Nigerians. people shouldn’t be allowed to threaten Nigeria and its people like this several times in a row and go undamaged. The most annoying is when it comes from someone who has been generously treated by the federation. Personally if I were president then All the ex-militants would be rounded up and would face a firing squad. El Rufai as well should be taken to court! Is this how politics is supposed to be ? Imagine Obama threatening america for his elections, what do you think would happen ?
        Are we animals ? What kind of democracy is this ?

      • igbi says:

        Just imagine Obama saying:
        “Yes I can murder you if you don’t vote for my candidate” instead of his notorious “yes we can”. Shall I understand that the only plans these “politicians” have for the future of Nigeria is to murder us if we don’t vote them in ? I pray for the day a no nonsense man gets elected president.

  22. tim says:

    It shouldn’t be left at that, because he has a history……..this is what we get for making terrorists billionaires!!

  23. ocelot2006 says:

    This is indeed great news. The Nigerian navy definitely know how how to impress. ‘can’t wait for the day we’ll have the first boomers in our fleet. A true tool for force projection along the West African coast and the Gulf of Guinea.

  24. Solorex says:

    Dear Sirs, I wish above several things that Nigerian navy would acquire a submarine, but not now, here are my reasons. If the navy will really buy submarine form China, it is most likely going to be a derivative of Russian Kilo sub Type (the Yuan diesel/non-AIP Type-with German engine). A pair (you always want to buy at least a pair so that your sub command is not grounded when one sub is in repair/upgrade).

    Two Submarine and handling infrastructure will likely be in the neighborhood of $ 540m-590m with torpedos only (for a submarine Virgin Country like ours) –For a worthwhile status of Anti-ship cruise missiles and AIP technology we are talking some $30m-50m extra for the missiles and guidance systems and off board maintenance requirements. I have not seen these kinds of concrete balls in the present setting of our military procurement.

    With about $600m, I think the Navy can have a new lease of green life with about three tear rubber maritime patrol craft (double your air patrol capacity), half a dozen decently armed corvettes (built in China Armed in France/Israel), Two fearfully armed OPV/Frigates and half a dozen Maritime Armed Helix for ASW that will strike fear into the heart of an undiscerning torp only submariner on a coast. My point is we need to start from the beginning, build ability to procure and maintain regular much needed platforms for patrol (More people are joining the piracy business more that the Navy is catching them!- that’s why we have an ever increasing number of incident of our coast), citizen evacuation in conflict areas, regional power projection and decent ability for gunboat diplomacy when necessary. After we have become successful in these, we can proceed to internationalize our status with subs and helix carriers. I have never seen any navy with Subs in this modern Era, which has not taken care of the basic stuffs.

    At best A Goodluck submarine is still on a paper-we may have started coastal hydrographic surveys, design of bases and docks e.t.c but it should still be some 5-6 years away.

    • igbi says:

      “More people are joining the piracy business more that the Navy is catching them!”
      That is a sentence I read on a western newspaper, but I wanted to ask the journalist where and when he checked the registry book for pirates, since you are repeating the sentence I would like to ask you the same question.
      By the way, your reason not to get subs are empty.
      And subs can help a lot in special ops against pirates hideouts (it can be used as a way to follow and spy on them in order to expose the entire network.
      every modern navy needs submarines, ans Nigerian navy is no exception.

    • igbi says:

      I don’t think your timing is correct. I do think on the other hand that procurement was hampered by Engozi and it is time to catch up with our time. The most important thing is that we learn the technology, but we can’t keep saying later, things need to happen now.

    • Akin Oges says:

      Oga, I appreciate your concerns with costs, support systems and tangible facilities for the proposed submarines. I believe, however, that we should get the subs (at least two units). In not too distant time, Angola would have perfected the process of acquiring an aircraft carrier; effectively the levers of influence (on balance) will go their way in the Gulf of Guinea. Consequently, we could potentially be blockaded by Angola if there are disputes. One answer to the Angolan jigsaw would be the acquisition of these submarines. And I agree with Oga Igbi, the subs will present us the quiet, covert and unobtrusive means of following the activities of those plundering our oil wealth and piracy in our waters. In any case, we give not enough credit to the ingenuities of our men in uniforms; I believe when the we get the subs they will rise to the occasion. Good morning Sir.

      • Obix says:

        First of all , i still don’t believe in Angola acquiring the “Príncipe de Asturias”. It doesn’t fit into any king of logical sphere. Like one expert mentioned, i quote- “Aircraft carriers are potent status symbols, and for many regional powers — especially those not operating within a capable military alliance — the draw of acquiring a carrier is this symbolic value, rather than any real capability gain. If these countries are interested in defending their maritime interests, it makes far more sense to invest in submarines rather than second-hand Western carriers, which are optimized towards power projection.”
        So, whether Angola is buying the carrier or not, the NN should go for subs!

  25. peccavi says:

    Oga Obix who said that and what were they smoking?
    Subs have a function, not sure Nigeria is there yet, but if you compare an aircraft carrier and a sub, give me a carrier everytime. How exactly will a sub stop oil bunkering? With a torpedo? A carrier can launch men and aircraft.
    Its a marketing gimmick.
    When you see our dry docks and infrastructure being prepared to handle subs then we know what will come. Unless our government is foolish enough to buy subs we can’t service

  26. ifiok umoeka says:

    Be away a while, hope I’m not 2 late 2 enter this sub gist!
    Let me start by saying that WE ARE LONG OVER DUE FOR A PACK OF SSKs!
    And we NEED the subs…NOW! However, I try 2 be reasonable!
    Sub in 2 – 3yrs? Possible but I doubt that it’ll be brand new!
    1. What was modeled is the S20, a scale down derivative of the yuan which is based on the improved kilo and Lada subs with German engines and French sensors. It takes a while 2 build a few new ones! Note, no contract has been signed! How long did it take russian 2 deliver vietnam’s? Moreover, its expensive (even the S20 scale down export variant, what was modeled, perfect 4 us)
    2. That will mean a song class (kilo clones), perhaps those updated with german engine, russian weapons and anechoic tiles and french sensor suite but it will still be an old yet expensive sub if those options are included, so why not get something better?
    3. The song is not wisper silent (except when running on batteries)! Its good but of course the are better subs! That it pulled a stunt or 2 doesn’t make it the best or among the best, othewise why the yuan class?
    4. If the song was so cool, how come the Chinese kept drooling over and picking the improved kilo which they now copied, they have 12 and their elite unit man them
    5. That the americans occasionally used LA class 2 surprise drug smuggles doesn’t mean its the norm! It was out of boredom and the need 2 keep neptune’s kids occupied (Soviet typhoons and deltas were rusting of the baltic) and the politicans love 2 hear such things. That said, talks of subs fighting bunkering and even dispatching illegal fishers doesn’t make sense for the simple reason that a ship moves SLOWER than a PLANE whether its a surface or subsurface ship! If u ‘dispatch’ an oil tanker with stolen oil, u get urself an oil spill that will make the ones we’ve been facing!
    If we are interested in checking oil theft, INVEST in PROPERLY EQUIPPED MR assets and the OPVs that will be vectored 2 intercept!
    6. The advantage of a sub is it stealth and the fear of not knowing it location (sea denial) and brothers, anti bunkering/EEZ enforcement can’t be done without surfacing! Do u know what intelligence goldmine that would be for wouldbe enemies? All they need do is feign dubious activity and BAM our tin can surfaces and the get the pics, evaluate the sensors and log the discipline of our boys/girls, so why don’t we just send catalog 2 them? It’ll be cheaper!

  27. ifiok umoeka says:

    Most if not all sub loss in peace time have been due 2 HUMAN ERROR and MECHANICAL MALFUNCTION! The former means TRAINING! The Kursk went down because a torpedo was not handled properly and it exploded and the Ming361 had engine failure and I suspect that the Indian kilo had some malfunctioning component 2 blame (have u heard of a surgeon 4getting tool under one’s organs…enough said!) The USS Tresher falls in this group too! Thus, training and maintenance is not something u wave aside

    We can end up with white elephants if. We are dumb, ask the Thais with regards 2 their carrier and ask the royal Brunei navy why they rejected those excellent f2000 corvettes and had them sold 2 Indonesia at 20%
    Of cost price!

    As for the 053s (good for patrols and training in my opinion), I’m sick and tire of old ships and stop gaps, if we want chinese ships, let’s go for the best we can afford, if it the F23 or even F24N(custom 2 us ) fine, I would prefer they 054 though! The also have a new stealth frigate in the 3500ton class that little is know about, perhaps its a smaller 054 or a grand size 056, we don’t know yet! The point is, get the best because we may have 2 wait 2/3 decades 2 replace them. Also, we should remember STRATEGIC DIVERSITY! An friend 2day may be a competitor or even enemy 2moro

    Do we need sub (3 minimum, 2 on patrol with one in maintainance), we need escorts, LPD, more OPV, mine sweepers, MRA, ASW aircraft (fixed and rotory wing) and in my opinion that Should occupy a higher position in the scale!
    By the way, the model is PRODUCT PROMOTION!
    Good morning

    • CHYDE says:

      Oga Ifiok, while most of what you said makes sense, the big question is: Why will the Chinese HAND OVER a Model of a SUBMARINE to the first lady or to any senior Politician/Naval Officer, WHY WHY WHY???, You may say product promotion, but will one promote a product in an area where there is no need of it? Just thinking

      • peccavi says:

        The First Lady is not a politician or a member of any legal chain of command, anything given to her is a personal gift and not an indication of procurement or policy (or at least shouldn’t be)

      • CHYDE says:

        Oga Peccavi,There was the naval Officer standing beside her, why not her personal security detail or aid, could it be coincidence? Well only time will tell

  28. beegeagle says:

    Coincidentally, the NN already own bases at the two deepest natural harbours – Ibaka and Escravos. Nobody knows for sure if, like I have suspected since personnel were sent to train in Pakistan, those are not built to handle submarines.

    As for maintenance, the Chinese who are almost certain to build any Nigerian submarines, are right now totally turning around the NN Shipyard. Point is, nobody knows the precise scope and details of that turnaround.

    These open-ended possibilities are likely to have one keeping his eyes on this ‘fast rolling ball’

    But like Admiral Max has stated in so few words, I doubt that anyone would begin to present models of submarines to operators of surface vessels except that navy is in the hunt for submarines or they are already building one for them.

  29. peccavi says:

    Oga Chyde, maybe because it was a Naval event. Women, particularly wives of dignitries are called upon to launch ships.
    In any normal context I wouldn’t read more into this beyond a cheeky marketing ploy/ gift by a shrewd arms manufacturer.
    Or of course Nigeria could be planning to buy submarines when we are yet to fully deploy a workable surface fleet or work up to a proper blue sea capability.
    Or maybe we have actionable intelligence that Angola has bought that carrier and plans to crew it with ex Spanish/ UK naval personnel while they sort out their own people
    Or maybe South Africa has got a Gulf og Guinea squadron they plan to place permanently off our coast
    Or maybe someone plans to put it in Lake Chad to fuck up Boko Haram when they infiltrate in their canoes
    Or maybe there is an election coming and we need big money white elephant projects to pretend to spend money on

    What do I know, I don’t even like the sea anyway

    • igbi says:

      It is almost like if it pains you to hear that the Nigerian armed forces are updating.
      What is there for you to gain in a weak Nigeria ?

  30. ifiok umoeka says:

    Oga Peccavi pls, pls, pls! Just gain control from laughing! Men, u brought tears out of my eyes! My! Subs in lake Chad 2 f**kup BH! Seriously, u need 2 consider standup comedy!

    @ Oga Chyde, if all the weapon models given 2 visiting dignitaries translated 2 real arms deals, the world would need the moon and perhaps mars 2 bunker arms! During air shows and arms expos, dignitaries are given models as well as brochures, I see no difference here! Its common knowledge that in our naval strategic plan, subs are items we hope 2 acquire! So, I THINK that the Chinese seize an opportunity 2 market!
    Friends, let’s remember that, this is all just speculation and WE DON’T KNOW yet if we are even seriously considering a sub!

    @ Oga Igbi, do u seriously consider that we will spend $800-900m 2 by 2 sub ( 1 sub which is the Nigerian way is pure madness) without a single active fighting ship or even boat? We don’t even have a FACM with functional SSM much more a corvette or say a FFG/DDG! Haba! With less, we can get something that looks like a real navy and not this coast guard in grey!

    Finally, in 2days defence spectrum people who know their onions don’t argue platforms but network! In other word, a single platform isn’t decisive except it works with other platform in an order to achieve common purpose, its called network-centric warfare and that’s what has separated the boys from the men!
    Do we need subs, BY ALL MEANS, however, as things stands, we need escorts and LDHs MORE than we need subs and acquiring subs b4 them is the height of stupidity! Get the escorts 1st and then the subs!
    We build navies from the ground up, WE’VE DONE A GOOD JOB THUS, LET’S NOT MESS IT UP NOW!

    • igbi says:

      So if I get it right, you are complaining that our navy doesn’t have enough assets, yet you complain when it tries to update its assets and add submarines (which would be useful not only for training the personnel on sub warfare but also to go after the international network hijacking our oil). Algeria and South Africa and Morocco all have subs, I guess you weren’t the adviser of their MOD. Things have to happen step by step, but what annoys me is when some people think the steps has to be according to their own thinking. There is no logical reason why you would say : “no we shall not buy subs yet”. You can try to justify it by exposing your logistical skills, but it all boils down to logical thinking, and sorry but you are wrong. You should rather be advocating that not only we should go for subs but we should also go for more frigates and all the assets you said we were lacking. even though you think it is expensive, let me remind you we owe all our money to the water and that countries with less than half of our economy operate these assets.

    • igbi says:

      How someone could suggest that buying subs would destroy the Nigerian navy is beyond me. I am not a logistical expert but I know when I am being played.

    • CHYDE says:

      Oga Ifiok, like i earlier said, i was just thinking (aloud) and asking questions, time will surely tell

  31. ifiok umoeka says:

    My brother Igbi, I don’t know whether 2 apologize for ur annoyance! While Algeria and South Africa both have subs (with the former planning for as much as 2 improve kilos 2 argument the 4 they already have), Morocco doesn’t!
    Have u seen the surface fleet of those navies u mentioned! FREMM – 1(option of 4) and FMMM(3) for Morocco, Meko A200 – 4 (option of 4) that’s if the don’t take the 6 FREMMs they sought from the Italians, F23 – 3(and upgrade of the Pakistani Chinese built Type F22 with option of 2) and Tigr -3 for Algeria and South Africa’s 4 Valor class Meko 200s! Note that I’ve not included any vessel less than a corvette here or their older escort vessels! Thus they all have A BALANCED FLEET!

    2ndly, if u know anything about subs, u’ll know that they are most vulnerable when leaving or returning to base! So, if u don’t have escorts and ASW/MR airborne assets, how do u protect ur precious subs? How do u prevent other subs (nuclear) from sneaking up and mounting sentry at ur own backyard (those diesel-electrics need 2 surface periodically if they are on extended deployment and SSN if present will take note)?

    3rdly, I’m sorry but I don’t understand where this ‘sub on anti pirate/bunkering’ comes from! Talk of logic and that’s the dumbest proposed use of subs that I know of especially since we will not have a lot when/if they arrive! I’ll state it again, anyone with the basest interest in effectively policing our EEZ will acquire MRA, Drones and a sizable no. of OPV and build a superb c2 infrastructure 2 coordinate the activities of these assets! Subs (diesel-electrics) have a submerge speed of 9 – 12kt max (if it operates surfaced then what’s the point), how much of our EEZ can say 2 subs cover in a 24hr period? u are the Mathematician/Statistician so pls help us do the math!

    • igbi says:

      I am not disputing the fact that you are an expert in logistics, but I don’t see how the navy would be worse off if it were provided with subs, that is not logically possible. Now I hear what you are saying, we need more assets, let’s also advocate for that, but let us not forget that we have to think for the future as well and I hardly see the future without sub capabilities. The nature of warfare is evolving, we have to catch up with our time.
      And I didn’t know morocco didn’t have subs, but for sure little Algeria and SA do.

    • igbi says:

      Our economy is big enough to provide the assets you are praying for and also get some subs.

    • igbi says:

      I wonder what next you will invent as an excuse not to go for subs.

  32. ifiok umoeka says:

    Brother, go back and read my post, I have said over and over that ‘WE NEED SUBS’ but we ‘NEED A SURFACE FLEET 1ST’! Or don’t u want us 2 have destroyers/frigates, FACM and a sensible amphibious capability?
    U and I know that we’ll not have all of them @ one, hence, the navy strategic plan of 10s with measurable time critical scaling!
    Pls, if we get 3 S20s 2day, how would u deploy them vis ur current threat! U talk of future but u 4get that the oil theft/piracy we’re talking about is happening as we speak! What stops us from getting the 2 recently decomm F122 that Oga Beegs keeps referring to while we decide on the FFG/DDG we should acquire for the long term or don’t we need those 2 2moro?
    Like I said, I’m all in 4 SSKs because we need them but we need those other assets more than we need subs!

  33. ifiok umoeka says:

    Fair enough

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