SUKHOI SU-27/30 FLANKER+JF 17 THUNDER MK.2 OR SUKHOI SU-34 FULLBACK+JF17 THUNDER MK.2; WHICH PAIRING WOULD REPRESENT A FULL SPECTRUM OPTION FOR THE NIGERIAN AIR FORCE AND WHY?

The powerful Sukhoi Su-34 Fullback, a potent 4.5G proposition which is somewhat constrained by a combat radius adjudged to be inadequate for requirements

Majestic in concept and delivery, the Sukhoi Su-27/30 remains our top pick for a deep strike, air superiority jet which is to cover our pretty expansive airspace and defend Nigeria’s interest well beyond a thousand kilometres from our borders without refueling. Overwhelmingly favoured by savvy Nigerians online.

JF-17 Thunder Block II – our top pick for a well-armed multirole, second tier jet. Her open architecture and formidable panoply of armaments makes the jet nearly irresistible.

BEEGEAGLE’S BLOG
20 February, 2015

Assuming that we are in tune with the performance specifics of these jets, let me go straight to the point.

The Su-34 Fullback is stern and a solid 4.5G jet BUT the combat radius is not all that. In my book, any jet acquired for ‘strategic intervention’ by the NAF should be able to do a 2,000-mile return flight into the sub-region/the Sahelian/Saharan lands from our flanks namely LAG, SOK, CAL and MDGR.

Even inside this country, a Seme-Abadam-Seme return flight will log up a full 2,000 miles. We have had enough of low aspirations. That is why all this suffering and ridicule. At a time, someone was tactless enough to pace our NAF using Chad and Cameroon as parameters. Well, it shows you how low are aspirations are that Chad have now gone on to acquire MiG 29s. This nonsense has to stop forever. It has gone beyond the pale and is no more a joke in any way whatsoever. We do not need to have our sensibilities affronted anymore.

If the NAF plan to acquire 40 JF17 jets, that plan, utilising the same financial outlay, should be revised to read as follows

* 24 units of new JF17 multirole jets

* 9 units of pre-owned Su-30 air superiority/deep strike jets

* 3 units of pre-owned Su-30 trainer variants.

When the NAF is meaningfully poised for national defence, it should look like this

LAG – three JF17 Block II multirole jets

MDGR – two Su-30 jets, three JF17 Block II jets and two F7 AirGuard

CAL – two Su-30 jets, two JF 17 Block II jets and two F7 AirGuard

SOK – two Su-30 jets, two JF17 jets and two F7 AirGuard

MKD – three Su-30 jets and four JF-17 Block II jets

ABJ – two JF-17 Block II jets and two F7 AirGuard

ENU – two JF-17 Block II jets

PHC – two F7 AirGuard

KN – two JF 17 Block II jets

YOL – two JF-17 Block II jets

KNJ – two JF-17 Block II jets

That is what I call a meaningfully and strategically poised airforce.

About beegeagle

BEEG EAGLE -perspectives of an opinionated Nigerian male with a keen interest in Geopolitics, Defence and Strategic Studies
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183 Responses to SUKHOI SU-27/30 FLANKER+JF 17 THUNDER MK.2 OR SUKHOI SU-34 FULLBACK+JF17 THUNDER MK.2; WHICH PAIRING WOULD REPRESENT A FULL SPECTRUM OPTION FOR THE NIGERIAN AIR FORCE AND WHY?

  1. Ola says:

    SIr Beegs! I am privileged to reply first🙂
    Well, I have always canvassed for Su 30s, I am bias towards it even though I’m not a military aviation expert. This is because of what I have seen. I would rather reverse the numbers you quoted above and suggest 24 units of SU 30 more or less same specs as the Su-30MKM variant 4 Su-27UB trainer version. Then comes 12 units of JF-17 block II, 2 of them being trainer versions
    I would distribute them across the nation exactly as you’ve distributed above except that the JF 17s would be replaced by SU-30s in many of the axis you listed above.

  2. Ola says:

    Line 5 is supposed to read ” Su-30MKM variant and 4 Su-27UB trainer version…”

  3. colloid says:

    Oga beegs, well analyse. For now, we know the JF-17 block II is a non-disputable assest for NAF now, so i wont dwell on that. But for su 27/30 or su34, i think to me, it’s highly preferable we go with Su-27/30 cox of it well proven “fighting” prowess. It has been in service for quite a long time now, so its deployment and mission is no more a problem. It is battle tested and battle proven. I will suggest we go for that. For su34, i consider that highly an answer to any F-16/15 threat. Am really enthralled with the “cobra” stunts both su27/30 and su34 can perform, something no jet can perform. For now we can get su27/30 jet, but if we want to be serious about “future” threats, i prefer we place an order for Su34 jets— it is more advance. It is designed to deliver high-precision strikes on heavily defended targets in any weather conditions, day or night, and fields weaponry that includes a 30mm GSh-301 cannon, up to 12 Alamo or Archer AAMs, ASMs, and bombs. The fact that The two members of the crew sit down side by side in a large cabin, with the pilot-commander to the left and navigator/operator of weapons to the right in a jettisonable Zvezda K-36dm seat [that has an inlaid system of massage] also make it something we cant ignore. The advantage of the side by side cockpit is to eliminate the duplication of instruments and controls of flight, which improves efficiency and comfort. As long missions require comfort, it has pressurization that it allows to operate up to 10,000 meters without oxygen masks, which are available for emergencies and combat situations. The members of the crew can leave the seats and be in vertical position and relax. The space between the seats allows that they can lie down in the corridor, if necessary,—-imagine this.

  4. Kola Adekola says:

    40 modern fighter planes is far too few. We must underline that first.
    My Oga’s, I have a very big quarrel with the numbers being bandied around.

    The Nigerian economy is accelerating and so we need to see our potential foes as beyond military minnows like Cameroon and Chad. Let us learn from recent history; it is the size of the Chinese economy that has resulted in America’s Asian pivot which is backed by aircraft carriers, submarines, satellites and other wonderfully dangerous gizmo’s that Nigeria cannot even remotely match. Think of the horror a “pivot to Africa” would look like with an unready Nigeria, an imploding North Africa and an uncooperative South Africa; this is not even countenancing our “stab you in the back” Francophone neighbours.

    If we are thinking about cost constraints, then the billion of dollars and shame boko haram has cost us should offer a very sharp mental realignment. Boko haram started out as a rag tag army armed with sticks, stones, bows and hammers. If at the time we had the arms we have hurriedly bought now, boko haram would not even have become anything but the tiniest of tiny blots in our history.

    We should be making rolling plans for a huge expansion of military capabilities. If our economy is between the 21st and 23rd largest in the world, it goes without saying that our army should be at least, the 21st most powerful in the world. Being a local champion with a 10 tonne economy makes little sense and is only asking for trouble (if it hasn’t already come).

    We should have no less than 100 modern fighter planes, backed by AWACS, refuelling tankers and electronic warfare capabilities. We must also join up our acquisition plans with local production and very clear technological and social goals.

    • CHYDE says:

      Well said Kola Adekola, someone mentioned that the Russians will not be willing to sell th SU 34 in a previous thread, but there is in fact an export version SU 32, and it is actually a long range beast. If I had my way I would prefer anything air force be sourced from Russia, be it SU’s and MiG’s, as well as helicopters, then most sea assets from China and some from Russia. We saw from this BH campaign the importance of air assets, so i’ll be biased towards the air force, most of what i’ve seen so far has favoured the NA, so let thw air force have a lion share of the $1bln.

      • CHYDE says:

        But then the prospect of tech transfer with regards to the JF17 thunder is very tempting to overlook. So thats a welcome option.

      • Kola Adekola says:

        Oga Chyde, there is also the possibility of technology transfer with the Sukhoi S-54. It is basically a baby Su-27; a trainer jet/light fighter with all the advanced flight characteristics of 4+ generation fighters, same all-weather multimode radar (Zhuk) as the tail radar in the Su-35.

        Development of the S-54 has stalled due to lack of customers. If Nigeria steps in, this could offer us a very good high tech opportunity with development of 4+ generation fighters which can be specifically tailored to our unique needs. The S-54 is a light fighter like the J-17, but no doubt, much more capable – I strongly urge our leaders to look into its acquisition. There is no harm paying over the odds for genuine technology transfer like Pakistan did for the J-17.

        I admit this is a projection for the future though and we should get J-17’s as a stopgap plug gaps in our current capabilities.

  5. Henry says:

    We could also add the MIG-29smt. This fighter seems to rival the SU-30. It also has a much improved range over older MIG-29 versions.

    “The upgraded model of batch production MIG-29SMT fighter has an additional two tanks of propellant can cover, without refueling, up to 3,500 kilometers and carry up to 5 tonnes of combat payload.”

    The SMT is also an open architecture aircraft.

    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/mig-29smt.htm

    • beegeagle says:

      The MiG 29SMT – THAT VARIANT specifically – fits into the picture for combat radius and payload. Usable in all ramifications…3,500km radius and 5,000kg of ordnance. That is really impressive. The MiG 29SMT should be seen as the Plan B where the Su-30 is not handy. We have had enough of short-legged, moimoi jets. E don do abeg.

      I shall come back later with views on how the US$1 bn PROCUREMENT largesse should be spent.

  6. beegeagle says:

    Hehe..I see you changed yours to 12:24 in favour of the Su-30s. If wishes were horses, I would ride as well.

    However, we are trying to ease the NAF into these waters but not at the deep end until they know the joys of the imperious Sukhois.

    Secondly, we are trying to help them keep operational costs down while pressing for total coverage of our airspace in a very powerful way.
    Imagine that OPERATING COSTS is one of the reasons why Nigeria do not field a 4th Generation fighter in 2015 yet Eritrea, with a GDP that is one-sixth that of Lagos State, field MiG 29s and Su-27s simultaneously?

    I think that distasteful alibi was just a mere ruse for low aspirations. What else were some outgone CASs thinking when they used to shout from the rooftops that the NAF have all it takes to defend our territorial integrity. Now they have struggled with the extended flightlines entailed in COIN operations across an area that is larger in size to England and Northern Ireland put together? What if we had stern interdiction to undertake in state-on-state violence? Our NAF would be shot down in one day? It was obvious that low drive and ambition became the NAF’s albatross, a force content to do just better than Cameroon, Chad, Togo, Niger and Ghana.

    Now Chad have grown a brain and reached for MiG 29s and some are still looking for ways to bury their heads in the sand and to pretend that it is not happening?

    What do we take to be our strategic economic interests and our national interest? Safeguarding our people and economy? We have blundered there as well. For over a decade, Angola have had Su-27/30s. From their non-contiguous territory of Cabinda, Angola can strike at our offshore oil installations and egress unchallenged. A F7 AirGuard dares not take off when an Su-27 is airborne…unless the pilot is resigned to certain death.

    From Illela in our Far North, Algerian territory lies just 500 miles as the crow flies and they possess Su-30s and MiG 29s and we are content with limping about in short-range F7s? Na wa.

    Serious nations pace themselves using nations which are doing better. We were content to do just as well as the low game in our neighnourhood. So Nigeria fly A-Jets as do Togo and we are doing just fine, we imagine? Now Gabon fly Mirage F1s just 300 miles to the south of Calabar and Chad now fly MiG 29s and we dare to slumber or wallow in self-delusion?

    Perhaps our national strategy is to feed the indulgences of politicians while hoping to smoke the peace pipe when trouble comes. I am glad that Boko Haram are so belligerent. Our Armed Forces would never have known growth for another fifteen years.

    Very ridiculous republic..mscheew😥

    • emereuwa says:

      Oga Beegs, honestly I feel and share your pain and frustration.
      God is using this BH debacle to liberate us from the slumber of our past policy makers.

    • Ola says:

      Yes Sir Beegs, to be honest, I expect our airforce to be reaching for 36 SU 30s and 18 Su-35s.
      If the NAF together with the FG wants to do the needful, we need 2 squadrons of troop support aircrafts like the SU -25, 2 Squadrons of interceptors and multirole aircrafts like SU -30s and one squadron of air superiority fighters like Su -35. When Russia offered SU-35 to South Korea then, they offered 40 aircrafts which were to be assembled in South Korea with full Technology Transfer for $5 billion. This is a deal no other country in the west will do and Korea backed out of the deal at the last minute because the US mounted pressure on them, more so, the US would have frustrated their efforts to rig them with western armaments which South Korea has stucked up.
      While it is good we have a rich blend of assets, I think it’s high time we think of a rapid and strong growth of our military domestic industry. How can we achieve that? By smilling with everyone and being a friend of all while we marry the country that will do deals with us. That is the Indian strategy. India is a friend of all, yet India grew her defence Industry riding on the back of Russia.
      If we want to acquire 2 Squadrons of SU- 25s, 2 Squadrons of SU-30 and one Squadron of SU-35. Even if we define our Squadron as 12 fixed wings each, that is talking 60 different fixed wings from the same family of aircraft together with their full complimentary arsenal. Russia will do this deal with us with a decade long intensive pilot and mechanics training program, domestic maintenance and prospective local assembly, with dignity and on a long term debt management and repayment scheme. It is time Nigeria becomes the hub for Africa just as China and India have been juggling for the hub position for Russian most lethal and formidable assets in Asia. As for the west, we should continue to buy trainer versions of their fixed wings in few numbers so that we don’t lose touch with their assets and be ready any day we need to do acquisition from them again.
      For once, we should take a bold step that generations to come will be happy was done. There is a time to break free and launch forward, now is the time Nigeria!

    • buchi says:

      EASY oga beegz everyone here can understand your frustration..how ever i will only place my bets on these once i see a JF-17thunder with the green white roundel.

      to be sincere in as much as i love your overall placement of viable aircrafts in our 13 mobility AC bases.but i humbly believe that no air command should have nothing less than seven fixed wing assets..force projection must also balance with acquisitions…having a minimum of three jets in scramble time in lagos isnt palatable especially based on the fact that if we are faced with a Naval threat(a Carrier) the most likely destinations will be choice hit on the coast lagos number 1(i suugest just as you say 3 JF-17 multirole alongside 4 F-7chengdu BGi versions and at least one su 27 or 30 as lead fighter…
      calabar you are absolutely correct..sokoto,maiduguri just like lagos should gulp a good amount of the spread.as they are our first line of contact by any probing hostile on a compass bearing..
      Abj being a heavy lift area and HQ command area should be saturated with more of air defense system and a little more of what you suggested..
      yes also as we deliberated on new acquisitions let us remember that to keep this new aircrafts safe and sound when not scrambled or in the airour air defense systems must be over hauled…even if we want to buy all 40 units of the jf(which i pray they diversify)and we purchase at least 13 units of s-300 ADMS and 7 units of s-400ADMS..the equations for the moment is balanced hence makes sense.but still my able oga beegz and ogas as we deliberate on this issue let us not forget our air defense structure and early warning plus detection system we must address this side by side..
      if we buy any thing we must have 2nd tier defense
      (please do correct me on any contradictions )
      good evening

    • buchi says:

      plus what ever we are doing we better do it fast the situation in libya is giving me the creeps i swear

  7. Augustine says:

    Oga Beegeagle, I fully agree with your analysis and suggested aircraft mix formula for NAF.

    24 units of JF-17 Thunder Block II jets with full armament options

    12 units of Su-30 Flanker jets with full armament options

    Let us forget about the older Su-27 jets, the Su-30 jet is the least we should get and I have looked at all variants of the Su-30, the best Nigeria can get is the Su-30 SM Flanker, it is the most modern, most powerful version in that series, beats the Indian MKI variant, the new king of Su-30 is Russian SM variant.

    http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/su-30sm-multirole-fighter-aircraft/

    Full armament options for all jets means, NAF must buy them armed with the best Radar, FLIR/IRST, TV / Video Camera (That detect enemy stealth aircraft evading radar), Targeting Pod, Reconnaissance Pod, Electronic Warfare Pod, Within Visual Range Missiles, Beyond Visual Range Missiles, Air To Surface Missiles, Anti-Radiation Missiles, Anti-Tank Missiles, Anti-Ship Missiles, Laser and Satellite Guided Bombs.

    That is what a modern day 2015 air force must have, especially now that Nigeria has more enemies surrounding us….dangerous wolves in sheep’s clothing.

  8. STARTREK says:

    Gen Beeg if I had my way you will be conscripted and commissioned a Red Neck by executive order asap.
    I salute you all compatriots.

  9. rugged7 says:

    Sounds just about right Oga Beegs.
    Vision is essential in the military leadership of Nigeria.
    They must see beyond the mediocre.
    Nigeria has been insulted and embarrassed, even by our backstabbing “friends” because of a lack of clear military vision for this country.
    THIS REALLY HAS TO STOP!
    To be fair, i think the Nigerian Navy is light years ahead of the Army and Airforce in strategic visions for the future.
    9ja no dey fear winch, we dey chop the winch and nothing go happen.
    And we no dey carry last.
    For the sake of our future generations yet unborn;
    Ogas @ the top, make una do the needful abeg.

    • rugged7 says:

      Everybody has lined up from Yaounde to paris to New york to Knife Nigeria continually in the back.
      Our ogas @ the top:
      Boy scout motto:
      Be prepared

  10. Augustine says:

    Who Has Ever Thought ?
    ==================================================

    Who has ever thought Nigeria will be called “Once Mighty” in world news ?

    Who has ever thought Chad will buy 4th generation jets and finally have air superiority over Nigeria ?

    Who has ever thought NAF will decline from almost 100 combat jets in 1985 down to about 30 combat jets in 2015 ?

    Who has ever thought that a tiny trainer jet call Alpha will be NAF’s leading combat aircraft of the 21st century 15 years into the new millennium ?

    Who has ever thought uninvited Rafale 4.5th generation jet fighters will be radar scanning and tracking targets along Nigeria’s borders on Borno state’s doorsteps ?

    Who has ever thought ‘Unidentified’ jet fighter will be bombing and killing people close to Nigeria’s border line ?

    Who has ever thought Chadian jets will be bombing targets inside Nigerian cities in our life time?

    Who has ever thought Nigeria will be called “Once Proud” by a Zimbabwean whose nation sent military officers for free training in Nigeria 1980s ?

    Who has ever thought nobody will pity Nigeria when she cries ?

    Who has ever thought NAF will no longer rival the great Ethiopian air force as we did in the 1980s when our air power level was being ranked world wide with latest versions of combat aircraft ?

    Who has ever thought NAF will say to Nigerian army in a war on homeland soil…”Nigerian air force does not have enough aircraft to give you all the air support you require in defending our fatherland.”

    Who has ever thought ? …..You ?

    • rugged7 says:

      Really sad,
      I weep BITTER tears for my dear country.
      Anyway, Nigerians are a resilient people. They will pick themselves up and push on.

  11. Are James says:

    SU 34/32 would be better than older models. I suspect there are improvements from the reliability and operating cost standpoint in these newer models. Obviously more with the SU 34 than the SU 32. Export models of anything apart from distinguishing producing country strategic requirements are also skewed in design towards high demand for spares after some years so that the producing country makes big bucks over the life cycle of the jets. In anycase the SU 32 is a GOOD. buy with some MIG 29 SMT thrown in. We need just half a. squadron of each and two mid air refuellng jets

    • Are James says:

      This is a RAFALE/MIG 29/ MIG 25 neighborhood. Anybody cheering our current performance, our procurement performance or any of the efforts made so far for any reason is committing an act of treason.

  12. Prinx Arthur says:

    for me,we need 15 units of SU-35 cos SU-34 is an aircraft carrier/naval version of the sukhoi family,20 units of chengdu J10

  13. beegeagle says:

    Like we said to Gen STARTREK elsewhere, it would send a very wrong signal and damage cohesion within the military IF all of that US$1 billion procurement largesse is shelled out to the NAF alone. The unclear message would be misread to mean that the NAF are the favorites of the FG and inter-service rivalry will attain a new crescendo.

    It is not in doubt however that the game changer and standoff stature we need now falls to the NAF to hold up. And there is nothing standoffish about F7s. I kid you not.

    Left to me, that US$1 BILLION PROCUREMENT FUND would be allocated as follows

    NAF – US$625 million
    NA – US$200 million
    NN – US$175 million

    Going forward, what I expect us to do wef 2015 is to ensure that an annual minimum of US$350 million is built into every year’s defence budget for ACQUISITIONS AND UPGRADES and be shared out as follows

    US$ 150M/US$100M/US$100M

    Every third year, each service will get to heave US$150m while ‘managing’ US$100m on each of the other two years. So if we start with the NA getting that US$150m in 2015, the NN and NAF would get US$100m each this year. Then in 2016, the NN would take the US$150m purse while the NA and NAF manage US$100m each. Hopefully, the pattern is understood. We must never go back to those sad times when year in, year out there was neither acquisition nor upgradation yet we were rolling out multi-billion dollar budgets.

    So IF we start from 2015, the NAF would have US$625m special procurement funds PLUS US$100m budgetary procurement. That leaves us with a purse of US$725 MILLION for the NAF’s acquisitions. We shall get back to you with ideas about how we should spend that money to look good and most menacing…

  14. drag_on says:

    I just saw the gazelle and puma flying overhead on the way to the airport. They must be coming from the range.

  15. Prinx Arthur says:

    The question we need to ask ourselves is this ;do we need a long range aircraft or an aircraft with more hard points eg. j10 vs Jf17

  16. 24 Sukhoi 30 Jets 12 JF 17 thunder Block 2 2 Trainer Variants of Each, reason? Sukhoi is a battle hardened craft, trainers would hv engaged enemy n can share tactics on air superiority, JF yet to be tested but comes with tech transfer, depending on hw effective we can order for more.

  17. in addition to the purchase of airframes we must do something urgent about the management and policing of our airspace. because it wont matter if our planes can go to the end of the world from here if we would not know when there is a foreign presence loitering in our airspace. every inch of our territory must have radar coverage and it must extend even beyond our territory. France could have jets flying over a part of Nigeria now and we would not be the wiser for it. the truth is right now almost anyone with an airplane can violate our airspace at the moment. and also we need to have advanced SAM sites scattered across the nation. It is only when we have secured our territory that we can seriously talk about projecting power beyond our borders. The Navy has had it good in the last few years because of the connection between the sea and our oil wealth. we needed to secure the investments in that sector and the navy wsas the only way to do so. we have always been reactionary and we prefer to put out fires rather than prevent them from starting out.

    • Rdokoye says:

      Nigerian’s tend to be reactionary and compulsive, the Nigerian Navy has been arming up, primarily because of the threat the Niger Delta militants poised. Today, we have a new threat, so we can be sure the Government will not stop at any turn to ensure that all arms of our military force are sufficiently armed.

      So if there’s someone positive to take from it, it’s that.

  18. drag_on says:

    I would suggest we get 12units of excess defence Su27’s and configure them as Deep-strike fighter bombers. Of these 3 dual seat variants tricked out in the growler role. We should take advantage of the radar aperture and load capacity of the aircraft to fit a huge powerful AESA radar in the nose together with cooling pods,power generating pods and computer processing pods. With radar sensor fusion with IRST and a capable Electronic warfare suit she should have 360 dominion of the electronic space she enters. Blinding others while picking out long distance low signature targets.
    Remember stealth is a system.
    All these will make it easier for the other Deep strike platforms to do their job without being detected.

    12 New su30s’ with dual racks for air superiority and escort work for the Strike su27s’.

    40JF-17s'( only if we get a slice in RnD and production, else less) The single engine workhorse meant for CAP,SEAD CAS ,ISR’ and support roles. Numbers to act as deterance.

    F-7 For Interception of aircraft that breach our airspace.

    Alpha jet.Trainer, low threat/ COIN jet. Short range ISR.

  19. asorockweb says:

    Oga Beegs,

    I believe you have set my preferred candidate (Su-34) up for failure, abi you bi INEC?

    Regarding the range of the Su-34, I got the following quote from Wiki:
    “The Su-34’s long range was shown in a July 2010 exercise when Su-34s and Su-24Ms were moved from Russian bases in Europe to one on the Pacific coast, 6,000 kilometres away, which requires in-flight refuelling. The exercise included aircraft carrying weapons at full load, simulated delivering them on a target before arriving at the Pacific coast base. Su-24Ms were refuelled three times, while the Su-34 was refuelled twice”

    I believe in terms of range, both aircraft are similar.

    The Su-34 is a modern rebuild of the Su-27, and it will be in Russian service for a very long time.

    I believe the two-tandem seats proves an advantage when pilot have to spend several hours on patrol, or during a complicated strike mission.

    Su-34 Fullback
    ——————–
    Strike/Multi-role. Two-sweater. Long range.

    Can perform interdiction, interception, as well as air superiority roles (as a high speed missile platform).

    Great for maritime environment as well.

    12-24 aircraft will keep all wolves at bay

  20. beegeagle says:

    I am currently looking at the photo of what is almost certainly a 4G jet. It is almost certainly a J10 and since China alone currently operate the aircraft, the semblance of a green and white roundel on its side makes the jet worthy of a closeup look. It was reportedly taken by a normally reliable spotter who is a Lagos banker, earlier this week.

    The funniest thing is that I faintly see a greenish roundel by the side of the aircraft. Waiting for Comrade McShegz to do the technicals.

  21. beegeagle says:

    Hehe..una don start.

    First of all, I am not confirming anything at all. The spotter is not a member of this online community but I do get titbits from around the world. Someone on this blog who knows the guy thought I should take a look at the photo which they thought was an F16 but I am sure that what I was shown is the photo of a J10.

    What I do not know is

    – how reliable is that spotter (not a Beegeagle’s Blogger) and did he snap the photo in Nigeria?

    – why I see the faint outline of what looks like a green-and-white roundel.

    Not confirming anything but I got interested because the NAF had previously looked at the J10…which I condemned for its offensively short legs.

  22. Obix says:

    kai, McShegz, should appear quickly before i come for him with SPETSNAZ🙂 .

  23. beegeagle says:

    The dude is a dud..lol. Some Nigerians can act desperate sha. We used web tools and it showed that the claimant photoshopped the pic.Back to business..

  24. Are James says:

    So it’s back to SU 34/32 and JF 17 in large numbers. Is the SU 25KM Skorpion procurement confirmed?

    • Augustine says:

      MiG-29 Vs Su-27 Flanker in Ethiopia Vs Eritrea war. Four MiG-29 jets were shot down by Su-27 jets in air to air superiority combats. Nigeria should buy Su-30 Flanker….the winner.

  25. rka says:

    I don’t understand why people want to hoodwink this blog. What is the agenda?

    May the fleas of a thousand camels invest their armpits🙂

  26. jimmy says:

    For Nigeria to move forward in terms of the NAF REALISTICALLY based on what happened with the boko haram saga one has to look at what happens when Nigeria decides to procure equipment the drama that ensues, by nature I abhor conspiracy theories and Lord know Nigeria put herself in this peculiar mess of LITERALLY being under a western imposed embargo maybe they want Nigeria to throw bombs from a Doriner like WW1
    Despite the fact that in choosing an aircraft it should primarily be based on ability, weapons systems, and technological advancements in Nigeria’s case we have to add three more things
    1)Technology transfer
    2) Logistics and spare parts
    3) Upgrades in other words do not sell us any plane that is not all weather, must have FLIR ability as well as PGMS.
    For this I humbly submit order of priority
    1) JF-17, It is a matter of defence priority that we get this bird warts and above all the PAF have stood shoulder to shoulder with us do not forget they are fighting one of the most extreme fringe groups in the world they have supplied us with PGMs. technical know how and that is what allies are supposed to do more importantly, i have yet to see ANYBODY from PAKISTAN in the military go on National t.v. and rubbish the Nigerian Armed Forces.
    2) The SU-27/30 because the Russians are a willing partner and are willing at a moments notice to supply us with parts and technical know how- also it will represent a marked shift away from Western sources that have become a symbol of unreliability.
    3)The SU32 but only after the su27 has been obtained to squadron levels X2
    My humble two kobos i leave the technical specs to the guys who know about such stuff ,My theme is reliability, Logistics and spare parts.

    • Bharat says:

      Two points General.
      1. It is a famous CGI which depicts F16 type above wing root conformal tanks on J-10.
      2. Roundrels are generally not painted on primary (yellow) painted aircrafts.

    • Augustine says:

      J-10 jet was never an option on the table, NAF never talks about it. Will be shocked if it was purchased. NAF is buying JF-17 as declared and is a good choice, but if they want to make a mistake they will buy MiG-29 jet that gets shot down all the time in air battles by it’s own contemporaries like F-16, F-15, Su-27 jets.

      The only interceptor jet this cursed MiG-29 loser has ever defeated is the older and weaker MiG-21….meaning a Chadian MiG-29 will wipe out a Nigerian F-7 jet that is just a little better than MiG-21.

      • asorockweb says:

        You are wrong about the MiG-29.

        It is one of the best close-in dog-fighters in modern aviation.

        This quote is from a German NATO pilot (Germany flew MiG-29s that were inherited from east-germany).

        “But when all that is said and done, the MiG-29 is a superb fighter for close-in combat, even compared with aircraft like the F-15, F-16 and F/A-18.

        This is due to the aircraft’s superb aerodynamics and helmet mounted sight. Inside ten nautical miles I’m hard to defeat, and with the IRST, helmet sight and ‘Archer’ I can’t be beaten. Period. Even against the latest Block 50 F-16s the MiG-29 is virtually invulnerable in the close-in scenario.

        On one occasion I remember the F-16s did score some kills eventually, but only after taking 18 ‘Archers’. We didn’t operate kill removal (forcing ‘killed’ aircraft to leave the fight) since they’d have got no training value, we killed them too quickly. (Just as we might seldom have got close-in if they used their AMRAAMs BVR!) They couldn’t believe it at the debrief, they got up and left the room!”

        http://www.16va.be/mig-29_experience.htm

      • Augustine says:

        You are very very very very wrong @asorockweb, MiG-29 is a loser jet fighter, it was shot down in every air to air combat engagement with it’s contemporary 4th generation jet fighters and about 17 units of MiG-29 have been defeated and killed by comparable jet fathers F-16, F-15, Su-27….while the MiG-29 could NOT NOT NOT shoot down one single such opponent in its about 30 year combat history. I don’t care what a private German pilot says, war history records ZERO for MiG-29 jet. FACT !

    • Looks to picture perfect to have been a random pic taken at an impromptu opportune moment

    • gbash10 says:

      Gen Beeg, that pix is a fake one, I have it in my PC, it is from http://www.china-defense-mashop.com the green roundel is a one fake too.

  27. giles says:

    after hearing all comments,i go with the crowd only Dat I prefer the su35 and the v tail version of the jf17.

  28. beegeagle says:

    Lol, Asorockweb. Not bursting your bubble. Read up the performance indices of even the extended range Su-32 here

    http://www.sukhoi.org/eng/planes/military/su32/lth/

  29. Manny Aaydel says:

    Dear Gen Beegs and other CyberGs, our greatest mistake in Africa is that we either do not plan ahead, or when some of people do, others fail to follow up. When the MMIA was commissioned in September 1979, yours truly was one of the reporters that covered the ceremony (one of the youngest reporters there on that day in fact). Our conclusion then? We do not need a big airport like this o, we all chorused. In no time at all MMIA became so small and we’re still struggling to expand it today! So it is with our other facets of life, including our military. The NAF, as one of the Ogas here posted above, was a darling of the continent in the 1980s with over 100 combat jets dazzling everyone to the point that Rawlings–a fighter pilot himself–said the boys flying could not be Africans until they brought the pilots to say ‘hello sir’ to him after their sortie on his first visit to Nigeria. I recall with nostalgia, how, in 1980/81 in particular, our new MiG 21 pilots were intercepting Libya’s MiG 23’s around this same Maiduguri airspace when the Libyans were occupying Aouzou strip in Chad and were harassing Hissen Habre’s regime. The Libyan pilots could not believe their eyes! Then we had benefitted from the forward planning of people like Ibrahim Alfa, who were light years ahead and who, fortunately, were veterans of the unfortunate civil war and so knew what to do! Alfa and co were going to start a project to build choppers, based on the combat history of the B-105 that we used extensively in Chad (and later discovered was not exactly delivering what the manufacturer-Messerschmitt- had promised it could do). Let’s keep the fine details under wraps for now. But his thinking ahead, together with his colleagues, resulted in the local production of the Air Beetle in the joint NAF/AIEP project! Did those who took over from him follow up? While we had another set of veterans following our ECOMOG ops, they appeared not to have leveraged on our experiences in Liberia and Sierra Leone (except for becoming interested in acquiring the Mi series of Gunships on account of its dexterity in the S/L theatre especially). I will put this to perhaps the involvement of the military in politics. I think it was difficult for politicians to cosy up to any renewed arming (recall the Bamaiyi-Marwa tango and the disciplinary problems in the Army especially in the run up to 1999. No civilian government coming in on the heels of those would have been interested in rapid re-armament etc). Maybe I’m wrong here but that would seem like the reason it was difficult to arm the military and instead, they were shunted towards more peacekeeping duties. When BH presented a viable threat however, our ECOMOG veterans appeared to have failed to properly project a new defence orientation. Even the NN that has become our darling today may not have risen in profile if not for piracy and how it embarrassed the force. All that is now history but it is positive for Nigeria that this blog has vigorously championed a ‘giant’ attitude to rearmament. As we keep debating that, let us remember that our defence policy MUST of necessity change too. That policy is decidedly defensive in nature and that has been another reason why we have been aiming low in our defence aspirations because our orbat has been in tandem with the policy in question. Now the game has changed o. With IS in Libya and the entire Libyan territory lacking in governance, and with Mauritania and Mali being in some ways potential Libyas, the NAF in particular must have platforms, like YESTERDAY, that can go anywhere and come back as if they never left MKD. The doctrine of the NAF should be like that of the NN…”To deny the enemy use of our territorial waters and assert our own right to any waters.” In effect, and as has been canvassed aggressively on this blog, let our flyboys be given assets that will ensure that they deny aircraft unauthorized use of our airspace while asserting our own right to any airspace! (The way Air Cdre Okoye led his Alpha jets through Cote d’Ivoire on their way to Lungi for the very first time as the vanguard of the ECOMOG Air Task Force after that country had flatly refused us use of an air corridor through its airspace).That is the type of mentality that will re-generate our military and bring back the NAF of the 1980s raised to power 5!
    As for those of us on this blog, we’re willing, able and ready under the ‘command’ of Gen Beeg to keep proffering ideas.
    Long live the Federal Republic of Nigeria.
    Viva Africa!

    • Are James says:

      Thanks. This is good.

    • Augustine says:

      My Ogas in the Beegeagle’s squadron, please pet us not mix apples with oranges.

      Su-27 is an older variant of flanker series becoming obsolete.

      Su-30 is the more advanced development and replacement of the older Su-27.

      Su-34 is the more advanced replacement of the strike role Su-24 and more of a guided mumitions bomber, just able to flex into other roles.

      http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/su34

      The Su-35 is a super advanced and a nearly stealth variant of the flanker series. It is expensive and extremely advanced so I don’t think NAF should jump from F-7 to Su-35 immediately. Let’s master how to walk before we start to run, lest we falter.

      It can be said this way….

      The Su-27 Flanker most often flies air superiority missions, but its most modern variants are able to perform almost all combat operations.

      There are several related more advanced developments of the Su-27, those improvements including the Su-30 Flanker two-seat, dual-role fighter for all-weather, air-to-air and air-to-surface deep interdiction missions.

      The Su-33 ‘Flanker-D’ is a navy fleet defense interceptor for use on aircraft carriers. Further versions of the naval Su-33 include the side-by-side two seat Su-34 Fullback strike variant and the more stealth-like Su-35 Flanker-E improved air defense fighter.

      So, what does Nigeria really need ? It’s not about what we want as citizens. Need, not want.

    • Capt Tobias Wilcock says:

      The Order of Air Battle layout should include
      A) INTERCEPTOR – Air defence assets. to react fast to national airspace intrusion. can be provided by the F7 which are point protection/ defense assets. located near the borders and close enough to get to intercept points before the intruders reach their objective, deployed in units of 2 -3 elements, this would be based on reaction time ( crew , aircraft performance , rate of climb, speed, range and recovery back to base.
      B) CLOSE GROUND SUPPORT AIRCRAFT – must be purpose built to carry enough ordnance load to and design handling and maneuvering capabilities at low level, the SU25 is only closely matched by the A10 Wart Hog, which carries a exceptional nose Gatling Gun. the SU25 beats it in performance ( speed and rate of turn at combat speed ). and also combat survibility for the aircraft and crew which is un=matched. it can be worked in concert with our current light strike assets ( A Jet, L39 – light COIN strike) , the SU25s are also execellent Rotorcraft killers, by it speed design envelope, they are capable of very close in ground engagements.
      C) AIR SUPERIORITY FIGHTER AIRCRAFT – The SU27/30 are more than enough to countering all aircraft around our borders, Mirages,Mig29s and most lethal being the French Rafael. SU27/30s design emphasizes that they must be able to dominate our airspace ( long range and endurance and adequate missile pylons) to deny the enemy all aerial operations and also have enough range to carryout CAP and effective dominance of the enemies airspace to allow our air assets to safely and uninterrupted to carry out aerial support activities including troop movement and logistics.
      D) DEEP STRIKE AIRCRAFT – The deep strike is both stragtic/tactical in use to hit fixed target locations and infrastructures within the enemy nations ( airports, hardened military airfields, power plants , radar centres, disrupt enemy supply lines, roads, rails, bridges, fuel dumps, etc. The Sepcat Jaguar used to be unmatched by it’s ability, it is one of the designed airframe emphasizes on high speed ( Mach 1 at low level, all weather ability, precise weapon delivery systems ( which was not in our package) but which is now out of commission. the Deep strike assets are normally to fast to provide very close in ground support in exception of carrying target designators and in coordination with talented forward air controllers, the SU34 would be adequate for our environment, the side by side cockpit is comparable to the F111 .

      POSITIONING /DEPLOYMENT – must be a game of chess against what is at the other side of the border and consideration capabilities of such aircraft ( type, range, bases, etc ) , this a form of deterrence on it’s own. Our asset (A) must be based in 2-3 deployed elements as point defence to protect air path ways to our main assets. including Air superiority bases, to prevent preemptive air strike/attacks and give adequate reaction time to our assets, they need to close enough to the borders to engage and receive advice from radars and surveillance aircraft.
      (B) Must be positioned close enough ground forces/ Army positions to be able to support both defensive operations and then move forward to more earlier prepared and located forward austere bases to support offensive ops military to give adequate time to get airborne, they cannot put in areas within easy range of enemy strike aircraft ( they would be focus of any preemptive strike, the initial objective should be to achieve air superiority, then kill off the other assets at will).
      (C) is our ace or Queen on the chess board, they must be protected and provided ability to get airborne in other to grant unhindered air operations to our other strike aircraft, they are safe away from the borders , hence with their endurance, in the defensive national airspace tasks, they can engage at an advantage over enemy aircraft who are the tip of their operational capability and having good range in the offensive mode ( over enemy airspace) they can pave the way for a counterstrike with our (D) assets.There has to be standing and well rehearsed plans and trigger point to effect an immediate devastating and overwhelming counter strike to take out all order enemy assets on ground, as well surviving and returning first wave elements from the other side
      as the return to their bases. even before ground troop movement
      The numbers must be what we can afford to maintain and deploy airbornes in with sufficient numbers to operate as proper squadrons and enough to protect our borders. yet not to be stuck later with a large number of outdated aircraft. the aircraft would fade away, but the operational capability of our pilots, flight hours and experience must be enhanced to meet the present challenges and those of the future. The close support strike aircraft is not to be left out of this shopping list. Just my humble view.

  30. gbash10 says:

    Fellow Compatriots, let me start by taking putting down some important quote from security/defence analysts around the globe; according to Femi Olubanjo, he said ‘ the wider and more complex a country’s role and commitment in the international system, the greater the threat to its national security ‘.
    My friends in the house, our National Security interest must be defined before we see the kind of robust armed forces that have been clamouring for.
    Our foreign and defence policy must match our new consciousness as we journey into the 21st Century. ..’…nations do not buy capabilities for the threats they face today, but as insurance against possible threats in 10-15 years ‘ .
    For any potential buyer of a fighter jet,that buyer in this context, the NAF must have a clear understanding of specifics or technologies of the aircraft in view.
    The flight performance, technical characteristics and combat capabilities of any aircraft primarily depend on their assigned role, tactical tasks and mission environment.

  31. Manny Aaydel says:

    @Gbash10, seconded sir. In addition, the capacity to maintain and regenerate what is to be acquired is as crucial as the act of the acquisition itself! The Murtala/Obasanjo administration (and, with due respect, not President Shagari as is always reported), went on an ‘acquisition spree,’ They ordered I Frigate (Aradu, from Blohm and Voss Hamburg, delivered in 1980, a few months after President Shagari assumed power), 2 No LSTs (from Howaldsverke, Germany–my spelling may be wrong), 2 No. Mk 9 Corvettes (from Voster Thornycroft, UK), 6 No FACs (3 from Construction Mechaniques in France and the other 3 from Lurssen, a German Shipyard) to mention some for the Navy; and signed a contract, late in 1975, for 90 MiGs from Russia (most of which were eventually not delivered for reasons unknown) without a proper articulation of our ability to maintain those platforms. We lost our Mk 3 Corvettes (NNS Dorina and Otobo) and had challenges with warehousing our missiles (a mix of aspide, seacat, ottomat and excocet all for the NN). Thankfully, the Nigerian Armed Forces of today have grown in leaps and bounds but as Gbash10 argues, I sustain the thesis that our future threat perception should integrate our analysis and solutions for acquiring, maintaining, deploying and regenerating any platform, airframe, device, equipment etc. that we induct for advancing or defending our national interest (which itself must be re-defined to drive our foreign policy and defence doctrine).

  32. gbash10 says:

    The aforementioned factors alone distinguish the Russian fighter from its foreign counterparts. The primary design role of the SU-34 Fullback is to replace the former Soviet Frontal Aviation mix fleet of battlefield interdiction and theatre strike aircrafts,comprising the SU-24 Fencers, SU-17 Fitters, MirG-23BM and MiG-27.
    The SU-27UB/27IB /SU-34 conceptual design to replace the SU-24 which was the most potent of the other strike fighters began in 1983.
    The thinking according to Dr Carlo Kopp,of Air Power Australia, was to provide better ergonomics for long range/long endurance/high work load profiles, better sanitary conditions for crew,facilities for the crew to eat meals on long duration profiles, and saving the cost of duplicating cockpit displays and instruments.

    • gbash10 says:

      The SU-34 Fullback is a heavy-long-range-strike fighter having the same total payload of up to 8 tonnes of all the types of precision guided munitions and dumb bombs that can be carried by the SU-30/35 Flankers!
      On the contrary, the SU-30/35 designs are primarily optimised for long-range air superiority role with their strike capabilities as a secondary role.
      My opinion is for the NAF to acquire a mix fleet of SU-30/35 Flanker multirole fighter jets instead of duplicating their role by also buying the SU-34 Fullback strike fighter.
      Those who are clamouring for the advanced SU-30SM Flanker,just forget it for now, the Russians will tell you NYET( capital ‘NO’) ! Until when the PAK-FA T-50 stealth fighter jet is matured.
      Note that the air-to-air missiles carried by the SU-34 Fullback is for self-defence against US and NATO teen series fighters, especially the F-15 and F16.

  33. asorockweb says:

    Quoting what Oga Gbash10 has said about the Su-34:
    The Su-34 was designed to replace the Su-24 in the “battlefield interdiction and theatre strike” role.

    But the Su-34 is also based on the Flanker and inherits a lot of it’s aerial characteristics.

    In today’s world of highly advanced missiles – AAM, ASM, AShM – what one really needs are good sensors, good avionics and high speed.

    The Su-34 will provide “battlefield interdiction and theatre strike”, which we sorely need.
    The Su-34 will provide deep strike, which we may need.
    The Su-34 will provide the high speed platform for Air-to-Air missiles, which we need to protect capital cities like Lagos, Abuja, PH, Kano, etc

    In the perfect world, we should buy a dedicated air superiority fighter and then a dedicated strike fighter. But I know we will only buy one high-value platform for the NAF. The Su-34 should be that platform.

  34. drag_on says:

    Oga Augustine,
    what we need yesterday is 6 introductory JF17s’ to help deal with non-state actors
    ( bokoharam) using precision strikes in their most remote hideouts. Also, an introductory half-dozen baseline Su27s’ to deal with any threats that might emerge from a possible disintegration of Libya. Estimated cost $200M, all from THIS YEAR’s budget.

    • gbash10 says:

      Seconded Oga drag-on for short-term,while the brand-new platforms should come-in later.
      The SU-30/35 and the JF-17 Bulk II should be our main air combat capabilities.

  35. Lordfej says:

    Hmm General beegs why do I have the feeling that this thread is a kind of research by people in power to sample the thoughts of defence savy Nigerians.
    Just a thought to ponder

    • sizzorkay says:

      What do you mean? Thought beegs is the only one that can start a thread here, no? So if that’s the case, your statement suggests he now work for the Government? lol

  36. jimmy says:

    http://www.naij.com/388690-trade-between-nigeria-and-china-hits-18bn.html
    This is part of the Financial aspects of what is going on in present day Nigeria .

  37. jimmy says:

    OGA Lord FEJ
    I sure hope those with the purse strings are reading and listening because if they are not reacting and doing things in the proper context as to re equipping the NAF to INTERNATIONAL standards Nigeria as a country will not be able to practice democracy because some half educated DIM WIT SAID SO
    What will be even more TRAGIC indirectly you CAN NOW expect CERTAIN Western World powers to go out of their way perversely to make this happen by not providing us with WEAPONS @ Critical times,

  38. gbash10 says:

    Point of correction Oga asorock, the redesigned of the SU-34 Fullback have a restricted dash speed of Mach 1•6 compared to Mach 2•35 for the SU-30MKI and Mach 2•25 for the SU-35 subject to increased speed with the new supercruising Al-41 powerplant.
    Aerodynamically, the SU-30/35 will perform the air superiority role as well as the strike role better than the SU-34.

    • asorockweb says:

      SU-35 is out of our league – it is very expensive.

      • gbash10 says:

        Oga asorockweb,Nigeria is not a poor country, we only need the political will.

      • asorockweb says:

        Oga Gbash10, Nigeria IS a poor country.

        But that is not the real problem.

        The problem is spending US$1billion on 12 Su-35s.

        Also, Russian only has a handful of Su-35s for themselves.
        IF Russia decides sell Su-35 to a foreign country, we will probably have to wait 10 years to get our 1st aircraft.

      • Are James says:

        Correct n please keep supercruising out of view. Aspiration is good, day dreaming is not encouraged. All these Mach2.25 dashes kill range and unless we routinely expect to be tangling with Rafale jets it is not helpful to be going into 5th gen territory.

  39. PRINX ARTHUR says:

    J10
    Crew: 1
    Length: 15.49 m (50.82 ft)
    Wingspan: 9.75 m (31.99 ft)
    Height: 5.43 m (17.81 ft)
    Wing area: 33.1 m² (356.3 ft²)
    Empty weight: 9,750 kg (21,495 lb[52])
    Loaded weight: 12,400 kg (28,600 lb)
    Useful load: 6,000 kg[52] (13,200lb)
    Max. takeoff weight: 19,277 kg [12][52] (42,500 lb)
    Powerplant: 1 × Saturn-Lyulka AL-31FN or WS-10A turbofan
    Dry thrust: 79.43 kN / 89.17 kN (17,860 lbf / 19,000 lbf)
    Thrust with afterburner: 125 kN / 130 kN (27,999 lbf / 29,000 lbf)

    Performance

    Maximum speed: Mach 2.2 at altitude,[53][54] Mach 1.2 at sea level[8]
    Combat radius: 550 km[52] (342 mi)
    Ferry range: 1,850 km[52] (1,150 mi)
    Service ceiling: 18,000 m[52] (59,055 ft)
    Wing loading: 381 kg/m² (78 lb/ft²)
    Thrust/weight: 1.15 (with AL-31FN3); 1.16 (with WS-10B)
    Maximum g-load: +9/–3 g[8]
    +

    Crew: 1
    Length: 21.9 m (72.9 ft)
    Wingspan: 15.3 m (50.2 ft, with wingtip pods)
    Height: 5.90 m (19.4 ft)
    Wing area: 62.0 m² (667 ft²)
    Empty weight: 18,400 kg (40,570 lb)
    Loaded weight: 25,300 kg (56,660 lb) at 50% internal fuel
    Max. takeoff weight: 34,500 kg (76,060 lb)
    Powerplant: 2 × Saturn 117S (AL-41F1S) turbofan with thrust vectoring nozzle
    Dry thrust: 8,800 kgf (86.3 kN, 19,400 lbf) each
    Thrust with afterburner: 14,500 kgf (142 kN, 31,900 lbf) each
    Fuel capacity: 11,500 kg (25,400 lb) internally

    Performance

    Maximum speed:
    At altitude: Mach 2.25 (2,390 km/h, 1,490 mph)
    At sea level: Mach 1.15 (1,400 km/h, 870 mph)
    Range:
    At altitude: 3,600 km (1,940 nmi)
    At sea level: 1,580 km (850 nmi)
    Ferry range: 4,500 km (2,430 nmi) with 2 external fuel tanks
    Service ceiling: 18,000 m (59,100 ft)
    Rate of climb: >280 m/s (>55,000 ft/min)
    Wing loading: 408 kg/m² (500.8 kg/m² with full internal fuel) (84.9 lb/ft² 50% fuel)
    Thrust/weight: 1.126 at 50% fuel (0.92 with full internal fuel)
    Maximum g-load: +9 g

  40. beegeagle says:

    OK gentlemen, let’s keep this real. The traditions of miserly procurement spending which has sufficed since President Shagari the Great left office SUGGEST that asking the FG to spurge anything beyond 35-40m USD on a single jet appears to be a pipe dream.

    A combat-kitted Su-35 costs about US$90 million apiece. Now if the attrition rates which initially hit the F7s, God forbid, apply to the Su-35s, does anyone believe that the FG will ever buy any frontline jets AGAIN if one US$90m unit gets lost in an accident?

    So we had better keep it real before this becomes a mere wishlist.The NAF need to walk before they run. Get pre-owned Su-30s for about US$15 million apiece. That is what the F7s cost and we lost a few. Hell did not break loose. Get brand-new JF17 Block IIs for US$25m apiece and you would be making sense. Get Indian support for the Su-30s and Pakistani or Chinese support for the JF17s. All will work fine. After five years and with attrition rates stabilized and mastery attained, not to mention a reduction in the price of the Su-35s to, say US$75m, the FG can then begin to phase in those jets at the rate of four-six units every other year.

    But for now, any talk of acquiring US$90m Su-35s will fully and finally scare away the already reluctant. In any case, if the NAF dare lose one of such units of Su-35s, there is guaranteed to be a free-for-all fight on the floor of the National Assembly as exasperated lawmakers pounce on those who sold the idea to them. A moratorium on the acquisition of airframes for the NAF might also be declared on the spot🙂. Haba, money wey dem for chop, na im wey one man crash for one jet?

    We need to be careful about what we are suggesting. Let us plot usable roadmaps. This is no Egypt where they spurged out on 24 units of Rafale jets at an average cost of US$200m apiece. In our country, some senators are still asking after the Murtala/OBJ and Shagari-era MiG 21s at Makurdi.Those are the ones you want to discuss US$90m fighter jets with? The plan will be dead on arrival. You had better believe it.

    Lol..I can even picture the look of outrage on their faces at the mere thought of asking for a fighter jet priced at US$90m which is liable to dropping from the skies for any number of reasons.

    • asorockweb says:

      Haha.

      They would ask “this Su–35, abi na only 35 people im dey carry?”

    • Kola Adekola says:

      Yepa! General Beegs, na im be say you no go efa support PAK FA T-50 or even F-35?
      Heheh!

    • Naijaseal says:

      For once, i’m laughing on beegeagles blog. “Money wey dem for chop”… classic. Lol

    • buchi says:

      oga beegs free for all fight only..hehehe..bottles and punches nko..looooooool
      some go ask if the SU-35 get 35yr waranty
      on a more serious note .NA has been upting their game seriously in the NA .the level of redeployment is stagering..in my state alone..NA personnel seemed to have vanished into thin air..very few patrols the main base nd FOBs tell the story a lot of troopers a being pushed to the NE..this remaining 5 weeks is going to be interesting and bad for BH news makers

    • buchi says:

      oga beegs free for all fight only..hehehe..bottles and punches nko..looooooool
      some go ask if the SU-35 get 35yr waranty
      on a more serious note .NA has been upting their game seriously in the NA .the level of redeployment is stagering..in my state alone..NA personnel seemed to have vanished into thin air..very few patrols the main base nd FOBs tell the story a lot of troopers are being pushed to the NE..this remaining 5 weeks is going to be interesting and bad for BH news makers

  41. beegeagle says:

    Haa, Asorockweb. I bow for those guys! “What of the MiG 21s at Makurdi?”. All of that so they do not have to buy jets for the NAF, thereby freeing up money to support the opulent lifestyles of our legislators?

    Even if technology were stuck in a time warp…asking for 1975 vintage MiG 21s in 2010? Meanwhile, dude probably drives the latest editions of Benz G-Wagon, Range Rover Sport and Bentley?

  42. drag_on says:

    But,seriously, why would anyone ask that kind of question.? How can you want to run a professional air-force and have people who see it as a career and profession yet fly a Mig21 ( chai, I forgot we are doing it with its F-7 cousin).
    If we want a professional force we have to give them platform similar to there conferes in other nations,if not the level of professionalism will start to drop. How can you maintain pride in the force if they think they are flying museum pieces when compared to their western and even African brothers. The more modern the platform the more professional they will want to be and the less interested in ‘civilian’ matters.

    As is, we can’t participate in any major air-force drills with tier one exercises like red flag ,shaheen,Indus viper and cope india because we are flying relics. We would even be embarrassed to run one in Africa if the N-Africans brought their SUs’andF16; East-African’s with SUs’ and Migs 29s;Southern Africans with SU30s’ and Gripens; and Central Africans’ MIGs.
    Lol, why is West.Africa behind the curve?The Rest of Africa is a level above us.

    Chai France, France am looking at you.

  43. beegeagle says:

    How do you see that working – the procurement company? Will they also deal with commercial outfits or do govt to govt which yields the best returns?

    We do need to have Hardware Systems Evaluation Units at ONSA and MoD. Absolutely sure of that. Will help standardisation and quality control.

    By the same token, the FMI and ONSA also need to have Social Media Engagement Units. The amount of security-related misinformation in Nigerian cyberspace beggars belief.

    • asorockweb says:

      I see the Procurement Company (NDX: Nigeria Defence eXchange) as a wholly gov’t. owned company.

      It is tasked with procuring defence-related articles on behalf of the federal gov’t (ideally, all governments, but that’s another story).

      What this means for the armed forces is that they can no longer say “we want F-7 jet fighter” or “give us T-72 tanks”

      The armed forces will set out their requirements, and there will be a bidding process.

      So if you want to buy MBTs, the army will set out it’s requirements for MBTs and companies have to bid on fulfilling those requirements using the MBTs they already have or proposing slight modifications to their already existing MBTs.

      Before all this, a credible, independent consulting firm will be tasked will creating and maintaining a list of companies that are direct suppliers of defence articles.

      The advantages of using NDX, the sole supplier of defence articles to the FG, is that NDX can now:
      1) Hire the best lawyers (so that we can avoid debacles like the Jaguar jets, and the Israeli Aerostar drones)
      2) Hire the best analysts (that means no F-7 fighter for the NAF or BMP-1 for the NA)
      3) And centralize oversight (yes, don’t shoot your general because you think he is chopping money)
      4) Ensure Standardization (5 types of armoured vehicles: NAV-1 to NAV-5; 3 types of combat helicopters, etc )
      5) etc, etc

      All this is just off the top of my head, you can make it a topic, let others chip in.

      • jimmy says:

        This seems like a good idea

      • Are James says:

        Good idea. Nigeria needs a dedicated procurement organization for defence materiel.
        Generals are not procurement experts.
        The skills we seek in this area are; procurement planning, options analysis between weapon systems, procurement legal studies, value for money analyses, local content (defence technology and manufacturing), contract placement services, contract administration, warranty, training, lifecycle support including maintenance and upgrades, logistics of supply, induction and operationalization liaison with MOD. Just 30 P&L experts, engineers, lawyers and political analysts will deliver these services to the FG without breaking the bank

  44. trigger says:

    18 units of SU-30 MK
    24 units of JF-17
    6 units of Su-25 (supported by 6 units of alpha jets)
    20 S-300 ADS TELAR + 100 missiles
    9k720 iskander theater ballistic missiles

    My 2 kobo for national security

    • buchi says:

      ballastic missiles haba bros easy..s-300 yes s-400 definitely..
      100 missiles
      9k720 iskander theater ballistic missiles ehm definitely not now but not impossible

  45. chynedoo says:

    Nigeria needs MiG 29 air superiority fighters

  46. buchi says:

    Arrest proves sect has European members
    • Bama, Baga about to be liberated as more insurgents are slayed in Sambisa, Gwoza
    • Chad inflicts more casualties on terror group
    Senator Iroegbu in Abuja with agency report

    Following the capture of eight French nationals who are members of the terror group Boko Haram, a diplomatic spat has ensued between France and Cameroun, which has insisted on trying the terror suspects.

    A top Nigerian intelligence source opened up to THISDAY on the brewing diplomatic tensions between France and one of her Francophone allies in the sub-region following the shocking discovery that some French citizens are staunch members of the sect, a throwback to their membership of the terror group, Islamic State in Iraq and Syria (ISIS).

    According to findings, France was reported to have chided her former colony for insisting on trying the terrorists in Cameroun instead of handing them over to the French authorities.

    Enraged by the audacity of Cameroun to hold its citizens, the French Foreign Minister, Mr. Lauren Fabuci, was alleged to have ordered that the suspects be handed over to the European country with immediate effect.
    However, Camerounian authorities were said to have felt slighted and have protested the manner in which France had demanded the release of its nationals.

    A Camerounian minister was quoted to have said: “Mr. Lauren Fabuci, the French Foreign Minister, has ordered Cameroun to release immediately eight Europeans captured by our security men, for being part of Boko Haram terrorists.
    “Mr. Fabuci demanded their immediate handover to France so that they can prosecute the terrorists on French soil, ignoring our sovereignty and independence.

    “The French are acting as if Cameroun is their errand boy that they can order around and ignore the fact that we have our own laws with which we can try the terrorists.”
    The latest revelation has lent credence to strong suspicions in the Nigerian intelligence community that Boko Haram has strong foreign backing.

    When contacted on the discovery of French nationals who had joined the terror sect, the Director of Defence Information, Major-General Chris Olukolade, said it was a matter for the parties involved to sort themselves out.
    “All I can tell you is that the matter is for Camerounian and French authorities to settle,” Olukolade stated.
    However, a top military officer said the Nigerian intelligence community had previously warned of a growing foreign collaboration with Boko Haram.

    He said other than Chadians, Boko Haram has a large presence of Arabs, Malians and other Islamists who have joined the sect.
    “Now we have seen evidence of French and European participation. This is one major indication that Boko Haram has very active and sophisticated foreign backing. I advise that the African Union should take this up.
    “France is trying to silence the Camerounians but Africa must rise to the occasion and take this findings seriously. They must not keep quiet,” the military source said.
    Meanwhile, the Nigerian military has continued its onslaught to rid the North-east of Boko Haram terrorists, as a concerted air campaign by the Nigerian Air Force has resulted in the death of a large number of Boko Haram terrorists in Borno State.

    This is coming just as military sources informed THISDAY that the boundary town of Baga and to some extent Bama, might have been liberated, save for few pockets of resistance by Boko Haram elements and mop-up operations in both towns.

    According to a statement yesterday by the spokesman of the Defence Headquarters, Major-General Olukolade, “A concerted air campaign by the Nigerian Air Force is ongoing in furtherance of the mission to clear terrorists from all their enclaves.
    “The air strikes which today (yesterday) targeted the training camps and logistics dumps of the terrorists in Sambisa forest and parts of Gwoza have been highly successful as it achieved the aim with required precision.

    “The death of a large number of terrorists has been recorded, while many others are also scampering all over the forest and out

  47. Capt Tobias Wilcock says:

    The Order of Air Battle layout should include
    A) INTERCEPTOR – Air defence assets. to react fast to national airspace intrusion. can be provided by the F7 which are point protection/ defense assets. located near the borders and close enough to get to intercept points before the intruders reach their objective, deployed in units of 2 -3 elements, this would be based on reaction time ( crew , aircraft performance , rate of climb, speed, range and recovery back to base.
    B) CLOSE GROUND SUPPORT AIRCRAFT – must be purpose built to carry enough ordnance load to and design handling and maneuvering capabilities at low level, the SU25 is only closely matched by the A10 Wart Hog, which carries a exceptional nose Gatling Gun. the SU25 beats it in performance ( speed and rate of turn at combat speed ). and also combat survibility for the aircraft and crew which is un=matched. it can be worked in concert with our current light strike assets ( A Jet, L39 – light COIN strike) , the SU25s are also execellent Rotorcraft killers, by it speed design envelope, they are capable of very close in ground engagements.
    C) AIR SUPERIORITY FIGHTER AIRCRAFT – The SU27/30 are more than enough to countering all aircraft around our borders, Mirages,Mig29s and most lethal being the French Rafael. SU27/30s design emphasizes that they must be able to dominate our airspace ( long range and endurance and adequate missile pylons) to deny the enemy all aerial operations and also have enough range to carryout CAP and effective dominance of the enemies airspace to allow our air assets to safely and uninterrupted to carry out aerial support activities including troop movement and logistics.
    D) DEEP STRIKE AIRCRAFT – The deep strike is both stragtic/tactical in use to hit fixed target locations and infrastructures within the enemy nations ( airports, hardened military airfields, power plants , radar centres, disrupt enemy supply lines, roads, rails, bridges, fuel dumps, etc. The Sepcat Jaguar used to be unmatched by it’s ability, it is one of the designed airframe emphasizes on high speed ( Mach 1 at low level, all weather ability, precise weapon delivery systems ( which was not in our package) but which is now out of commission. the Deep strike assets are normally to fast to provide very close in ground support in exception of carrying target designators and in coordination with talented forward air controllers, the SU34 would be adequate for our environment, the side by side cockpit is comparable to the F111 .

    POSITIONING /DEPLOYMENT – must be a game of chess against what is at the other side of the border and consideration capabilities of such aircraft ( type, range, bases, etc ) , this a form of deterrence on it’s own. Our asset (A) must be based in 2-3 deployed elements as point defence to protect air path ways to our main assets. including Air superiority bases, to prevent preemptive air strike/attacks and give adequate reaction time to our assets, they need to close enough to the borders to engage and receive advice from radars and surveillance aircraft.
    (B) Must be positioned close enough ground forces/ Army positions to be able to support both defensive operations and then move forward to more earlier prepared and located forward austere bases to support offensive ops military to give adequate time to get airborne, they cannot put in areas within easy range of enemy strike aircraft ( they would be focus of any preemptive strike, the initial objective should be to achieve air superiority, then kill off the other assets at will).
    (C) is our ace or Queen on the chess board, they must be protected and provided ability to get airborne in other to grant unhindered air operations to our other strike aircraft, they are safe away from the borders , hence with their endurance, in the defensive national airspace tasks, they can engage at an advantage over enemy aircraft who are the tip of their operational capability and having good range in the offensive mode ( over enemy airspace) they can pave the way for a counterstrike with our (D) assets.There has to be standing and well rehearsed plans and trigger point to effect an immediate devastating and overwhelming counter strike to take out all order enemy assets on ground, as well surviving and returning first wave elements from the other side
    as the return to their bases. even before ground troop movement
    The numbers must be what we can afford to maintain and deploy airbornes in with sufficient numbers to operate as proper squadrons and enough to protect our borders. yet not to be stuck later with a large number of outdated aircraft. the aircraft would fade away, but the operational capability of our pilots, flight hours and experience must be enhanced to meet the present challenges and those of the future. The close support strike aircraft is not to be left out of this shopping list. Just my humble view.

    • Oje says:

      Unless we embark on a military operation against say Chad or Cameroon we will not really know what we need at this point in time. America’s painful withdrawal (The U.S military has never been defeated in pure military terms) from Vietnam was the catalyst that helped the U.S fine tune its strategy and develop new weapons systems. For example Vietnam showed the stupidity in Americans fighting an air war with F-4 Phantoms not fitted with guns. By the 1980’s the Americans had recovered from the shock of Vietnam and built the most sophisticated and fearsome fighting force not seen since the days of Imperial Rome.

      Back home our military operations against Boko Haram have opened our eyes to the advantages of Drones and advanced surveillance system,if not i assure you the Nigerian army would never have been interested in flying remotely piloted armed Drones.

      Our military capability can best be tested against adversaries like Cameroon and Chad not Boko Haram. %60 of Nigeria’s current military arsenal cannot be used against Boko Haram.

  48. Oje says:

    Weve been on this for years now, Ivan Ivanovich will not sell to us any of these platforms unless there is a strategic advantage to gain. Ivanovich is just like Uncle Sam, but then again for some weird reason it appears Nigeria is really keen on this Apache Helicopter Gunship. That helicopter is extremely difficult to operate even by American pilots, why are we still going on a wild goose chase here?

  49. trigger says:

    Hmmm don’t be alarmed by the term ballistic missile. The iskander is a THEATER ballistic missile that is, it is short ranged.
    By the way it is presently one of the most accurate short range ballistic missile in the world. With this weapon we can hold all target in West African and as far as Libya at ransom. In case we need to cut logistic and supply lines linking Chad to the Northern African hemisphere some day.

    Its Circular Error Probability is about 5-7 meters. Imagine having such weapon! You probably wouldn’t need an air force after you purchase this because its precision strike potential is superb.

    Since we didn’t acquire SCUD missiles when our mates where getting theirs, this is the next logical step.

    My 2 kobo for national security.

  50. Augustine says:

    MiG-29 SMT…..Is To Be Avoided….NAF, Don’t Risk Another Mistake
    =======================================================

    As a manufacturer, MiG’s business fortunes tell a sad story of botched export campaigns, high-profile technical issues, embargoes and a failure to capture any of the meager pickings on offer from Moscow’s Defense Ministry. Time and again, promising—and arguably more capable—MiG designs have been axed in favor of keeping Sukhoi’s production lines busy.

    Back in 2006, Algeria ordered the MiG-29 SMT as part of a huge defense sale from Moscow, supposedly worth $7.5 billion.

    Deliveries of the first aircraft began before the end of 2006, but the Algerians soon noticed that something was very wrong. The “new” fighters weren’t that new at all. The SMTs had been assembled using old, unsold airframes from old MiG-29s that had been languishing in open storage at the Lukhovitsy factory.

    They may even have used airframes built for Iraq, way back in the late 1980s.

    This was in breach of the contract, and Algeria ordered deliveries to be suspended. When deliveries resumed in 2007, the same situation was apparent. Algeria refused to pay, and instead demanded multi-role Su-30MKA fighters from Sukhoi.

    View story at Medium.com

    • Augustine says:

      Click on above aircraft image for MiG-29 SMT story source and full details.

    • Bharat says:

      Again another case of sensationalism. Catchy headline.
      Where has Russia claimed that ‘SMT’ is a new production standard? Any article from your side will be welcome.
      Russia had always claimed SMT is an upgrade package for legacy/classical MiG 29.( Those built during Soviet era)
      And where do you apply upgrade package?
      I can’t comment on what Algeria was promised as I am not privy to it. But, what in the article exactly says it is a Lemon?
      It compares MiG 29 SMT with Su 30/35 and MiG 35, it a million dollar question which one is better?

      Myanmar was the last customer for classic/legacy MiG29 (B,SE and UB), they didn’t opt for SMT package on them. Those were semi built or built but not used airframes from MiG which were completed and delivered. Each around 26/27 million $ at 2009 pricing.

      So, as I have said earlier in another reply to Beegs, SMT is a not a new production standard. New production standard is M/M2 or K/KUB or MiG 35.

      Why would one go for SMT, if new airframe is the requirement? They would go for M/M2 or MiG 35 which has almost most of SMT package integrated in them by default.

  51. Oje says:

    If only Atiku had not kotowed to American pressure and scuttled the ballistic missile proposal from North Korea Nigeria would have had an independent missile force able to rain down destruction to as far as N’djamena and Yaounde and Sambisa.

  52. Oje says:

    Oga Augustine, Russian weapons have never been reliable, they are a shade above the Chinese but of course you speak against Russian weapons in favour of Western Weapons at your own peril in this blog. I am sick and tired of the way Russian weapons are romanticized here. No serious and very capable military fields a majority Russian weapons. Yes Russian fighters can do Ballet in the Sky with their ”Cobra Maneuver” but then what after that? We need to tow the line of the South Africans and Malaysians by incoporating a mix of Western,Chinese and Russian hardware. Our Navy is effectively made in China as we speak, our army and airforce needs advanced systems, too bad Obama will rather die than see the sale of Western weapons to Nigeria, even if its a made in America Ladder or Hammer Obama will block it.

    • Kola Adekola says:

      You think Russian weapons are not advanced enh?

      There are some stories about the aircraft carrier, USS Donald Cook in the Black sea; there is also the absolute lack of photographic evidence of Russia’s intrusions into Ukraine (due to Russian electronic warfare) even though heavy weapons make it across the border. General Philip Breedlove, NATO’s supreme allied commander for Europe notably said that all NATO could see each time Russia crossed into Ukraine was air defence system heat signals and electronic warfare signatures. That is real high tech.

      Russian weapons are just as good as Western ones. If they are available for the right price we must not hesitate to buy them.

  53. igbi says:

    a)What weapons do the Russians use ?
    b)Is the Russian military a serious and capable military ?

    answer:
    a) the Rusiian military uses Rusian weapons
    b) even america is afraid of Russia.

  54. igbi says:

    US weapons are overrated and expensive and unfit for those who are unwilling to spend a trillion dollar on a war.

    • Oje says:

      Mr Man, i could go to youtube and post hundreds of equally PR videos of Chinese,American,British,French and just about any other countries PR videos. Russia today cannot even build a standard carrier, it is France who has built two Helicopter carrier vessel just recently. Russian systems are good no doubt but against Western systems they pale in comparison. Why else do you think China has largely stopped procuring Russian arms and instead would rather steal American military secretes and copy .

  55. Oje says:

    Stop that ” because i cant afford it hence it is useless” banter, overrated expensive piece of junk huh? where has our ”Cheap and fit” Chinese and Russian weapons gotten us so far? America is about to project power thousands of miles away from home anywhere on Earth because of its decades of Research and Development with a robust industrial complex. American weapon manufacturer mainly makes their weapons solely for the Pentagon, suited for their own kind of warfare and strategy so dont come here and stand saying that ”Anything made in America is crap” banter. Everytime Russian and American weapons confront each other in a real shooting war what has been the result? and please dont give me that ”lack of trained personnel” too.

  56. Oje says:

    Indian Air Force unhappy about progress of PAK-50.

    http://www.janes.com/article/42765/indian-air-force-unhappy-at-progress-of-pak-fa-fifth-gen-fighter

    Its been nearly 15 years since the F-22 can into being and Russia is yet to field its own 5th Gen fighter. The U.S is right now working on a 6th Gen fighter as well as long range armed Drone bombers that can operate on aircraft carriers, this is done chiefly as a response to the ”et unproven” Chinese DF11 Carrier missiles.

    • Bharat says:

      “The Indian Air Force (IAF) has expressed concerns to Russia over technical problems and delays plaguing the USD10.5 billion Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) programme, which is based on the Russian Air Force’s Sukhoi T-50 PAK-FA platform”

      Wrong choice of headline from janes.

  57. Oje says:

    Oga, please stop the spamming. There are thousands of videos like this online.

  58. igbi says:

    US army is so funny that each time it is used the country almost goes bank rupt, can you imagine ? Spending one trillion dollars on a war, and they didn’t even win the war. In collateral murder you see the us airforce send a missile which costs about a million dollars to get just one guy suspected of being a mere footsoldier. If taking out just one guy costs you 1 million dollars, then you can understand why a war would cost you more than a trillion dollars.

  59. igbi says:

    Chinese weapons are top notch

    An idea of the training Nigerian soldiers got from Russia:

  60. Oje says:

    They spend billions maintaining 650 bases world wide because just about every little spark everybody starts calling for the Americans. You are hypocritical and confused. It is the same you angry America is unwilling to ”spend its tax payers money” to fight Boko Haram. Just yesterday Egypt called for ”American military intervention” to help flush out Islamist in Libya. In the Philippine its leaders are calling for greater American presence to check China’s rising hegemony, in Iraq and Syria Americans are already involved. In Ukraine the EU wants greater American assistance to check Ivan Ivanovich, in Liberia American servicemen are still there fighting Ebola, in Chad U.S commandos are training Chadian forces to fight Boko Haram.

    Now answer this question, why is it nobody calls China or Russia for help when ever ”person shit for church;;, why is it always AMERICA? Turkey and Saudi Arabia are mad at America for not doing more to kick Assad out of power. Meanwhile our ”beloved China” is busy grabbing chunks of Real Estate illegally and our dear Vlad is busy redrawing the map of Europe and backing Rebels alive, not even the tragic shooting down of the Malaysian civilian airline was enough to deter him. Hell is an Asteroid was en route to it is still AMERICA the world will call on.

    SO PLEASE NEXT TIME KEEP YOUR ANTI AMERICAN BANTER TO YOUR SELF WHERE IT BELONGS.

  61. lachit says:

    well the discussions going on is interesting but with regards to procurement of AIR DEFENCE SYSTEMS i belive some of you have got your priorites wrong.
    most of the bloggers on the net dont understand how a integrated AIR DEFENCE SYSTEM WORKS believe me i was also one of them untill i had a interaction with a leading scientist involved in designing SAMs.

    1.First and foremost you need to develop and integrate a AIR DEFENCE NETWORK in a NETWORK CENTRIC ENVIRONMENT. this is specific to every country in line with their specfic needs and requirements.it consists of various radars,early warning systems,advanced computers, C4I systems, a specified chain of command and plus a cyber command if deemed necessary.
    eg.
    India’s air defence network has two principal components—the ‘Air Defence Ground Environment System’ (ADGES) and the ‘Base Air Defence Zones’ (BADZ). The ADGES network provides for wide area radar coverage and permits the detection and interception of most aerial incursions. The BADZ system is far more concentrated with radars, interceptors, SAMs and AAA units working in conjunction to provide an intense and highly effective defensive barrier.

    2.SAM
    They can be broadly classified into 3 types based on range and to some extend mobility

    a.LONG RANGE SAMS eg s-300,400,500,RIM161 etc
    they are usually geared towards providing anti ballastic capability.
    the main purpose of these missiles is to force enemy planes to either abort their missions or to take evasive measures that is to drop their mission load thus effectively stopping their intended mission.
    fighter planes are highly manuverable therefore it is highly unlikely that they will be shot down since these missile have to travel a long distance and the plane is likely to detect the emissions from the missile itself and take appropriate measures.ie their kill probability is low against agile fighters.

    however against bombers these missiles are highly effective since the bombers are not so agile and therefore might not have enough kinetic performance to evade the incoming missile.

    ************* hence we can say that the main role of long range SAM is to force agile fighters to either abort their missions or to force them to lower altitudes where they can be engaged by medium range and short ranged SAMs. plus they can provide ABM capability(it is important to note that requirements for anti missile and anti aircraft are different in terms of ability to have enough lateral acceleration,g-force etc)************

    b.MEDIUM RANGE SAMS eg rapier aster kub barak 8 etc
    these missiles provide a much better kill probabilty as they are able to pull much higher Gs.
    and they are equipped with active seekers with mid course guidance.since the distance covered by these missiles is less than that of LRSAM the fighters have less reaction time to take evasive maneuvers.thus they have a higher probability TO

    1.shoot down the fighter OR TO
    2.force it to take evasive actions OR TO
    3.force it to even lower altitudes where it can be engaged with 100% kill probability by
    SHORADS AIR DEFENCE GUNS etc

    c.SHORT RANGE SAM (SHORAD) eg stinger mistrel igla spyder etc
    these are quick reaction missiles with almost 100% kill probability they have higher kinetic performance, can pull the highest Gs and their seekers are highly advanced infra red/active radar seekes which can easily kill even maneuvering fighters.
    they are also highly effective against cruise missiles, helicopters, guided munitions etc

    Thus we can conclude that just buying s400 0r 500 is not the solution then the enemy planes are simply going to use terrain following/hugging technique to fly below the radar horizon to evade your missiles/radar.

    also SEAD/DEAD missions are usually carried out to destroy radar/missile launch sites etc.missile systems with large logistic footprint,semi mobile/static SAM are going to have a tough time surviving,especially LRSAMS and certain MRSAMS.

    a good example is how the US penetrated the pakistani airspace and the advance pakistani air defence with czech anti stealth radars etc etc became a laughing stock.

    • Lordfej says:

      This has been very educative and thank you for doing the research

    • lachit says:

      additionally the performance of LRSAMs against aircraft with poor counter measures will be high.overall the kill probability is 30-40 %.
      aircrafts with with active jammer, active towed decoy,EW pod with updated threat library will have a 99% chance of survival unless the pilot starts dozing and goes off to sleep.

      MRSAMs kill probabilty is 70-90% depending on the radar system utilized and the effectiveness of the missile itself.
      eg barak 8 has a active seeker with mid course guidance plus it can be guided all the way to the target itself by the multfunction radar on the ground .
      if the ground radar is targetted by an enemy aircraft with anti radiation missile,the radar will be switched off but still the missile with its own active seeker will shoot down the attacking plane.

      SRSAM or SHORAD stinger mistrel igla are very effective against low flying but the kill probabilty wil hover around 70-80%.
      however newer SHORADS like SPYDER etc have close to 100% probability since it has two types of missile one with infra red and another with active seeker plus spyder has its own radar /electro optical system for tracking and target engagement giving it much higher kill ratio compared to standalone SHORAD like stinger igla etc.

      in short a country will need all three types of SAMs in a layered structure to complement each other in order to provide a effective air defence

      hope it will clear many preveling misconceptions

  62. lachit says:

    @beegeagle
    do you have any info on nigerian presence/delegation in AERO INDIA 2015

  63. ugobassey says:

    @ Oje and @ Igbi
    ultimately we want to win this war and project our strength. It doesn’t matter where we get our platforms as long as our boys are adequately trained to operate them, we develop and inculcate a culture of maintenance and finally we acquire sensibly for the medium term goal of local production. Truth be told international politics is nasty, you share bed with a nation today and tomorrow with that nation’s adversary.
    bottom line…be self sufficient.

  64. drag_on says:

    What is all this talk about American weapons? Simple 60s’ era cobra helicopters they openly refused to sell to us putting us at a level below the Arab nations in military co-operation. Forget about teen series fighters, they are not selling to us or any nation in sub-saharan Africa. If they were, it would only be armed with rockets.The most advance platform we can hope to get will come from the East. Then only non-eastern platform we may be able to get in full is the Saab JAS 39 Gripen.
    At least, the JF-17Block2 is about as good as the F-16blockA.
    India has been able to defend itself using Mig29s’ and SU30s’

  65. Oje says:

    It’s not just American weapons per say, Western Weapons while expensive are far more reliable. Russians are the best in defensive weapons systems and understandably so, they have more to fear from an armed attack than Fortress America separated by the North Atlantic. Nigerian military officers are arguably the most educated in Africa, if you see them longing for American/Western weapons then you know they have a reason to. We don’t need Russian SAMS, we don’t need those noisy Russian Helics that Boko Haram can hear when coming from 5 miles out, Ivan will not sell us advanced SU 27/35. What we need is the ultra quiet Apaches that can sneak up above tree tops and rain down lead or rockets from 2 kilometers out. We need more of those Chinese Drones, we need more kevlar vests for front line troops, we need American Intelligence gathering capabilities, we need highly trained Special Forces, we need the JF-17 Thunder. We need to throw away those AK-47 our front line troops field, it’s “stopping” power does not compensate for its limited range. We need the West to win this war,. China and Russia does not have the capacity to help us in a strategic sense.

    • Ola says:

      Mr. Oje, I have been reading the argument between you and Mr. Igbi. I must say that I have enjoyed your arguments BUT I THINK both of you seem to see each side from the extremes. I want to reliably inform you that there is NOTHING the “west” has that Russia does not have an answer to. In addition, Russia makes it easy and cheap. I could tell you what I have personally seen first hand at the level of infantry equipment and artillery pieces. The state of an average small artillery piece that Taliban and other rebels had in Helmand province was so deplorable yet they were unbelievably functional and deadly. I can tell you that “western” equipment will not function any more if they were in the same state. Also, the ruggedness of small arms from Russia beats anything the west features. I can tell you that I have seen scopes made in 1981 in the soviet union being used by a Taliban sniper that was neutralised. It was impossible to tell the colour of the body again, we could only read the serial imprinted on the side, yet the glass was SCRATCHPROOF. Nothing that I have seen from the west, even a decade after that time matched the overall quality of that scope. The country that I see is having the potential to outperform the rest if it develops the will power tomorrow is Germany. Their men continue to feature some of the best infantry gears in ISAF and NATO, even though they maintain low profile.
      I hope you know that in spite of NASA’s multibillion dollar yearly budget, they continue to look up to Russia for cheap, reliable solutions to their problems. Till tomorrow, Russia continues to ferry US personnel and equipment to and fro the ISS, more so now that shuttles have been retired.
      In my opinion, we need both sides and we need to stay as a friend of all, slave of none. I am of the opinion that right now, it’s time for us to end insurgency harassment in Nigeria and also grow our domestic industry, for reasons we do not know, the west does not support these ideas. The only way forward therefore is to turn to Russia like China and India has done. For all our armed forces, to be honest, I would rather go with only Russian or mainly Russian equipment for now while we stay open and receptive of opportunities to get western assets too. Chinese equipments are coming up fast but they are clones of Russian equipment and they still lack the finesse and ruggedness of Russian equipment, it takes the blood, suffering and bitterness the Russians have endured from the second world war through the cold war and till now to develop the skills and technology they possess.
      Lastly, I can arguably say that regular blackhawks and apaches are not less quiet than the regular Mils. Again, each sides have developed more quiet variants of their helios but these are depolyed in small numbers and for SO only by the armies using them.

  66. igbi says:

    The west and its weapons are useless, we don’t need them just the same way Algeria ans Sri Lanka didn’t need them. No country which has defeated an insurgency used western weapons, rather they used Russain and Chinese weapons. Russia and China are here to stay, they are reliable, the west is not. The wests weapons are overhyped and expensive. Which means that it is suicide to rely on them.

  67. igbi says:

    SU35 rocking Paris air show

  68. igbi says:

    Russian Stealth 1st public flight: Sukhoi PAK FA T-50 at MAKS airshow

  69. igbi says:

    Being expensive is not a guarantee of being reliable, it is rather a guarantee that the engineers lack imagination. When a weapon costs too much, it becomes useless.

  70. igbi says:

    We need to buy some of these

  71. igbi says:

    Russian SUKHOI SU 35 performing COBRA MANOEUVRE Awesome pilot skills

  72. KKY says:

    DefenceInfoNG: FLASH: Troops have this afternoon captured #BAGA after fierce battle with terrorists. Heavy Casualties. Mopping up ongoing. Details later

  73. colloid says:

    Seems we don take control of BAGA also. Next will be Bama and according to MJ Chris Olukolade, Bama liberation is almost concluded. GodBlessNigerianMilitary.
    Nigerian army says it has recaptured town of Baga, where Boko Haram militants killed scores of people last month
    This breaking news story is being updated and more details will be published shortly.
    http://m.bbc.com/news/world-africa-31568055

  74. prinx Arthur says:

    Soldiers have retaken Baga next is bama just got the news from DHQ

  75. jimmy says:

    http://www.premiumtimesng.com/news/177283-nigerian-military-recaptures-baga-heavy-casualties-in-battle.html
    OGA BEEGS Iknow this is SATURDAY MO BE NI JO
    We need a thread o Maj GEN OLUKOLADE IS CONFIRMING.
    much as we love to listen to oga igbi and oga oje banter I B EG / BIKO/ JO/ DAN ALLAH THIS IS BIG.

    • igbi says:

      Kudos to the men in uniform, please this time make the info visible to all, perhaps we could provide videos to Russia Today, and increase the reach of our NTA.

  76. okomonika says:

    russian arms are excellent get a smerch rocket system and bh would be roasting like the chechen rebels.

  77. Oje says:

    Oga Old you are mistaking but first of all let me correct your views on America depending on Russia to go to Space. First of all military/Space largese have no place in today’s world. It costs NASA billions for the Space shuttle to carry payloads to Space,in times of economic strain why waste billions when there are literally dozens of private space companies in the U.S able to do the same job for as low as $50 million or less. Americas stop gap measure to depend on Russian boosters to launch payloads have paid off. In the last couple of months we have witnessed successful launches to Space by private American companies for a fraction the amount so who is smarter? Russia relies on ballistic missile rockets to launch payloads but there are limitations. As of this writing Russia has lost its ability to detect ballistic missile launch from Space because it’s early warning satellites are no more functional, it’s scheduled launch of replacement SATS just last November have been delayed twice by technical glitches. Russia is at least 2 decades behind America and Europe in Space despite being pioneers of Space exploration.

    The farthest any man made object has ever gone is the American Saturn satellite launched in 1976, as we speak it has reached the edge of our Solar system and still going. The Europeans have achieved the remarkable feat of having a man made object land on a comet. The Mars Rover satellite is still on Mars and Russia have nothing close to the Hubble Space telescope. The world still relies heavily on the American GPS and it took 25 years for Europe to field something comparable. I can go all and on but no need, your view that America relies on Russia to go to Space is misguided.

    Lastly I reiterate again my point, Russian weapons tech are of course good but it is no where in the league of America. Russian legacy fighters might be very manoeuvrable but they are not better than American or European fighters. Russia could not even raise the ill fated nuclear submarine the Kursk when an on board explosion (common in Russia) sank it to the bottom of the Barrent Sea. Yeltins refusal to accept European help sealed the fate of the crew.

    Lastly America is not called the world’s unique superpower for nothing, no army can conduct global strike operations on substandard technology and hardware.

  78. Augustine says:

    Good news? Was Baga not free before now? Chadian army claimed to have liberated it 20 days ago as their first successful combat mission in Nigerian territory, so how many times are we freeing the same Baga town?

    “The Chadian military has liberated the Nigerian towns of Baga, Dikwa, Malam Fatori, Damasak, Ngala and parts of Bama in the past four days, according to a spokesman for a Nigerian militia group and reported by Bloomberg.”

    http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2015/02/france_assists_chadian_forces.php

    • igbi says:

      the author of the longwar journal article seems to be living in a parallel universe. The quality of western press is deplorable. To think that I used to believe them when I was a kid, makes me wonder.

    • Kola Adekola says:

      We need to assume that the Chadians are lying each time they speak. Every town they have “liberated” just seems to grow a boko haram infestation. Most famously, they claimed to have liberated Gamboru, only for boko haram to attack the Cameroonian half of Gamboru (Fotokol) and slaughter 600 soldiers and civilians. Something similar happened in Malam Fatori and Bosso.

      The fact that there is a very high proportion of Chadian membership in boko haram, coupled with boko harams field tactics being identical to the Chadian army’s should strongly focus minds. Further, the Chadian army’s bloodthirsty battlefield behaviour (which was fully on display in CAR) is no different from the behaviour of boko haram.

      What I found most useful from the Chadian account of their “liberation” of Dikwa was that all the witnesses interviewed had taken the opportunity of the “liberation” to “RUN AWAY” to Cameroon! Interesting stuff! Who runs away after being liberated?

      As General Olukolade hinted, our neighbours armies are deeply involved in boko haram. Nigeria’s use of the AU/UN mandates has shamed them into stopping boko haram from openly escaping into their countries, as well as stopped them from openly providing safe havens for boko haram (especially Cameroon).

      Chad is doing the macabre dance of a hyena today, but as soon as boko haram is wiped out in Nigeria, the very same AU/UN mandate will give Nigeria power to cross borders with overwhelming force and purpose to “chase boko haram.” The key phrase is “chase boko haram.” I pray that happens, because it will be the first step in moulding our neighbourhood in our own image.

    • igbi says:

      Doesn’t it beat logics to say someone is a spokesman and still keep him or her anonymous ? Since when are spokespersons anonymous ? Verrysoon they will start quoting anonymous presidents.

  79. Kola Adekola says:

    NICE ONE! Today is ROAST A TERRORIST DAY!
    Fleeing Boko Haram terrorists drown in Lake Chad
    http://www.premiumtimesng.com/news/177287-fleeing-boko-haram-terrorists-drown-in-lake-chad.html

    Three gboza for awa gallant guys! Gboza! Gboza!! Gboza!!!

    …And Oje, please quit the fan nonsense. America is not selling weapons to us. Period.
    Exept you have found a way to break the arms embargo on Nigeria, talking about American weapons is just impractical NOISE.

    In short the two things that give me a fit of the vapours each time they are mentioned are:
    1. Chengdu F-7
    2. American weapons

    Don’t spoil my weekend abeg.

  80. beegeagle says:

    Chad lied..period. They did not take any Malam Fatori (which was the first town they claimed to have entered whereas the world only acknowledged their entry into Gamboru)

    IF they really took Malam Fatori, how come BH attacked Bosso and Diffa in Niger from that location?

    A part of pre-colonial Greater Baga called BAGA SOLA is in Chad Republic. That is where they are and it is not known to play host to BH insurgents. If they were in the main BAGA which the world know to be Nigerian territory, Nigerian troops should be linking up with Chadian troops there and not causing insurgents to take flight.

    Please let us stop amplifying drivel. We all have the gift of discernment and can make deductions.

  81. makanaky says:

    I knew all along and I don’t trust Chad as they are BH, however we must acknowledge their PR mechanism is dam good.

  82. Oje says:

    Alright alright, from now on I won’t make mention of America again, but remember none of u guys here complained when America was dashing us two high endurance warships free of charge.

    • alade says:

      that may be true but why did they make the high endurance cutter chase a harmless vessel bt they allowed the Philippines to up armour theirs…they hav a reason for everything.

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